Why I Care About Your Unnecessary Medical Procedures

Heather R · December 2011

Ruh roh, someone doesn't understand peer reviewed research or the difference between opinion pieces and objective expository writing.

anneimal98 · December 2011

OP is an example of the ignorance and stupidity that is rotting this country from the inside out.

In one paragraph she claims her nurses and doctors were incapable of giving her correct (or even any) advice on her labor and in the very next paragraph she admits to and relies on their superior knowledge to support her claim that not having an epidural allowed her child to avoid the NICU, and displays no awareness of contradictory nature of these positions or how the latter undercuts the former.

ChristinaD09:

There was no way I should have been able to deliver him without all sorts of medical intervention. I did, thanks solely to my doula. My son was flipped, and I was having cluster contractions for hours. The nurses were livid I insisted on a hep lock, and they didn't know what was happening/why I wasn't progressing/how to help. My Dr. kept telling me I was going to have to be hooked up to an IV and have pitocin. I refused. I had made no progress for 8 hours (seriously, sitting at a 1 for about 8 hours), but was in a lot of pain because of him being flipped/cluster contractions. My doula showed up, got him flipped through changes of position, and within 45 minutes I was at a 7. I was in a lot of pain and had a narcotic. My son was crowning when my Dr. rushed in the room 30 minutes later.

Several nurses and one of the pediatricians said I probably avoided NICU by not having an epidural. I don't know enough about all of this to know whether that's true--but the nurses and doctors know more than I do.

She then goes on to display a stunning failure in reading comprehension:

ChristinaD09:

Insurance trying to charge more/not pay for VBAC: https://www.ims2007.org/c-section-rate-impact-on-health-insurance/

the last sentence was especially on-point:

The women who become uninsurable or have to pay higher premiums, or those who have to look all over their state in an effort to find a VBAC provider ? while suffering from pregnancy signs and symptoms, are on the losing end. So are doctors and hospitals, who are essentially forced to take insurance costs as well as the best medical interest of the patient into account when making decisions. And then there are health insurers, who are paying for all these initial c-sections. Perhaps it is time for something to change, in everybody?s interest.

This article does not say that insurance companies are trying to charge more for or not paying for VBACs. It points out that, in fact, VBACs can be more expensive than c-sections because TOLAC's have increased risks, require additional precautions, and may result in a c-section regardless and/or other complications requiring surgical intervention.

emsumm · December 2011

Lol, Heather.

Try as I might to ignore the OP, I can't help but say this:

It's lovely that for some, birth can be an experience. For me, it was a means to an end. It was not about what I wanted. What I wanted was to go into labor, be in a birthing room, and to deliver my twins vaginally. My doctor wouldn't allow it. Why? Because he is responsible. Because twin A was frank breech and to allow me to try to birth them vaginally was dangerous. At that point, the birth wasn't about me. It was about them. They do not care how they came out.

Oh, and FWIW, I had a spinal and didn't have any NICU time, either. I am so baffled about that part of your argument, OP.

I know anecdotal evidence means nothing, but I am guessing that there are lots more of us who would have loved to deliver vaginally, who pushed our own wants and needs aside for the health and well-being of our babies (and our bodies). I think you would be hard-pressed to find anyone on this board who waltzed into the hospital and demanded an elective c-section with no medical basis. VBACs are rare because doctors don't like risk. Same with delivering breech babies, sunny-side up ones, and all the other hosts of reasons that women end up having C-sections.

How bad of a person am I that I am really hoping OP ends up with a section?

kyoto · December 2011

heckysue:
kyoto:
There is no free health care. It is paid for with high taxes.
Well why don't we poll the Canadians and see if they'd rather adopt our system then...

I'm not stating an opinion on whose system is better. Only that it is not 'free'.

MegGary · December 2011

who wants to take bets that OP has either an epidural or c/s w/ her next birth?

kcl22 · December 2011

I just have to chime in here... Hospitals are reimbursed based on a patient's DRG (diagnosis related group). The more intervention needed for a DRG = more $ paid by insurance. Being admitted for child birth is one DRG. It's unrelated to how the baby is delivered.

Hospitals make money on admissions. Whenever a patient is admitted they get the DRG reimbursement. As the days go on they make less and less. When a woman delivers vaginally she (normally) stays 48 hours. C section patients are in house for 72-96. So, although c sections do pay more than vaginal births, in the long run with more c sections hospitals are losing money because that c section patient is taking up a bed that could have been filled back to back by two women having had vaginal births.

I would argue the increased rate of c sections is more related to poorer health in the general public, leading to increased risk factors, leading to doctors not wanting to have to use their malpractice insurance.

Luckie519 · December 2011

CinemaGoddess:

No, you're missing the point.

We've had this discussion already. We had it a year ago when most of us were still in 3rd Tri.

We've talked this topic to death and it is not changing people's minds.

I mean, really, if anyone's mind changed because of a random internet person with no real studies or anything to back up their claims, then that anyone needs to take a Bumpcation.

So you need to take the stick out.

Merry Christmas.

Yes LMBO, really!

cynnichinny13 · December 2011

jlthompson19:
ChristinaD09:

As for the snarky comments about my "natural birth" agenda, I didn't have a natural birth. I had an injection of a narcotic in my hep-lock. But yes, I didn't have an epidural. My son was a month early. My bag had torn early, I was bleeding, and my Dr. had to break my water. There was no way I should have been able to deliver him without all sorts of medical intervention. I did, thanks solely to my doula. My son was flipped, and I was having cluster contractions for hours. The nurses were livid I insisted on a hep lock, and they didn't know what was happening/why I wasn't progressing/how to help. My Dr. kept telling me I was going to have to be hooked up to an IV and have pitocin. I refused. I had made no progress for 8 hours (seriously, sitting at a 1 for about 8 hours), but was in a lot of pain because of him being flipped/cluster contractions. My doula showed up, got him flipped through changes of position, and within 45 minutes I was at a 7. I was in a lot of pain and had a narcotic. My son was crowning when my Dr. rushed in the room 30 minutes later.

Several nurses and one of the pediatricians said I probably avoided NICU by not having an epidural. I don't know enough about all of this to know whether that's true--but the nurses and doctors know more than I do.

But that was me. I appreciate that some c-sections are necessary. And some epidurals, for pain management! (I was in a lot of pain, I understand). And that every birth is different. For some, maybe the epidural was necessary, and I'm glad they had the option. But for many, it's not. For many women having c-sections, it's not. And someone is paying for it. That's the point.

So, you risked the life of your unborn child to save us all from higher insurance costs? Thanks?

iPhone ate my rant. Key points:

-Yeah, I thought that too.

-OP, stop making decisions for others.

-Stop making decisions for self.

-I'm worried that she will use "warm fuzzies" as an alternative for someone in medical distress as to avoid taking them to the hospital.

It's not as affective in bullet points, but I don't want to type it all out again.

melody921 · December 2011

Que_Syrah:
I bet if you found actual data related to what drives up insurance premiums, you would find that elective c-sections are probably a pretty small percentage if they're even on the radar.
Now overweight Americans and smokers? They drive up healthcare costs.
And epidurals? Give me a break.

Yeah, I seriously doubt my decision to have drugs affected anyone else's bill.

melody921 · December 2011

MegGary:
who wants to take bets that OP has either an epidural or c/s w/ her next birth?

lol

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