BFing controversy

sparkymcgeee · November 2011

Woman who BF's 5 yo son. She says it's because he has milk allergies. I find nothing wrong with her five year old son drinking HUMAN milk rather than cow's milk. I am a bit squeamish that it's coming straight from the tap but I'm not going to judge that woman for feeding her son the only milk his body can handle.

And GO!

CanuckFan03 · November 2011

Hmmm, if you're not ready to give it up, then say so. I find it hard to believe that with the zillions of milk substitutes, there isn't one who works for him. If there isn't, she can pump. She's choosing not to, so I'd say this is something Momms wants. I think the kid will get made fun of, and kids aren't as polite as those adults that said nothing.

Is she nursing him at recess while he's in school?

sparkymcgeee · November 2011

He may have just turned five so he hasn't started kindergarten yet. Preschool is different but maybe he's only there for a few hours a day. I do agree with you about the pumping thing. No need for it to come straight from the boob. It probably is a lot to do with the mom but those milk substitutes are super expensive. If she can get his milk for free then why not? Would I prefer her pump though? Absolutely, but it's not my child and not my choice.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

If she wants to do it fine, but I think it's weird and I have no problem saying that out loud.

I also think she needs to start saving for his therapy later on in life.

tokenhoser · November 2011

Still within the human normal range of weaning... if this was in Mongolia, people would tell her she was raising an excellent future wrestler.

We put a lot of cultural baggage on breastfeeding.

iris427 · November 2011

Five year olds don't need milk, just saying.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

tokenhoser:
Still within the human normal range of weaning... if this was in Mongolia, people would tell her she was raising an excellent future wrestler.
We put a lot of cultural baggage on breastfeeding.

This isn't Mongolia.

Cultural baggage? Yes, we've evolved differently and I appreciate it. Especially in cases like these.

tokenhoser · November 2011

Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
Still within the human normal range of weaning... if this was in Mongolia, people would tell her she was raising an excellent future wrestler.
We put a lot of cultural baggage on breastfeeding.
This isn't Mongolia.
Cultural baggage? Yes, we've evolved differently and I appreciate it. Especially in cases like these.

As long as you admit that there's nothing biologically wrong with it. I wouldn't expect the kid to need therapy. The inlaws might.

Would I do it? No. Would I freak out about it? No.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

tokenhoser:
Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
Still within the human normal range of weaning... if this was in Mongolia, people would tell her she was raising an excellent future wrestler.
We put a lot of cultural baggage on breastfeeding.
This isn't Mongolia.
Cultural baggage? Yes, we've evolved differently and I appreciate it. Especially in cases like these.
As long as you admit that there's nothing biologically wrong with it. I wouldn't expect the kid to need therapy. The inlaws might.
Would I do it? No. Would I freak out about it? No.

My 3 year old is aware. Socially, spiritually, physically. I can tell you right now, if it were MY child? He'd be needing therapy, because he's going to REMEMBER suckling on his mother's breast. Oedipus complex? Heard of it?

tokenhoser · November 2011

Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
Still within the human normal range of weaning... if this was in Mongolia, people would tell her she was raising an excellent future wrestler.
We put a lot of cultural baggage on breastfeeding.
This isn't Mongolia.
Cultural baggage? Yes, we've evolved differently and I appreciate it. Especially in cases like these.
As long as you admit that there's nothing biologically wrong with it. I wouldn't expect the kid to need therapy. The inlaws might.
Would I do it? No. Would I freak out about it? No.
My 3 year old is aware. Socially, spiritually, physically. I can tell you right now, if it were MY child? He'd be needing therapy, because he's going to REMEMBER suckling on his mother's breast. Oedipus complex? Heard of it?

Well, gee, your kids are totally safe from this risk, aren't they?

I really have no worries if my kid can remember breastfeeding. If he is still breastfeeding as a toddler or preschooler, we'll work on social boundaries of where I will and won't do that. Which is the real issue from that letter, to me, not a 5 year old breastfeeding.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

tokenhoser:
Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
Still within the human normal range of weaning... if this was in Mongolia, people would tell her she was raising an excellent future wrestler.
We put a lot of cultural baggage on breastfeeding.
This isn't Mongolia.
Cultural baggage? Yes, we've evolved differently and I appreciate it. Especially in cases like these.
As long as you admit that there's nothing biologically wrong with it. I wouldn't expect the kid to need therapy. The inlaws might.
Would I do it? No. Would I freak out about it? No.
My 3 year old is aware. Socially, spiritually, physically. I can tell you right now, if it were MY child? He'd be needing therapy, because he's going to REMEMBER suckling on his mother's breast. Oedipus complex? Heard of it?
Well, gee, your kids are totally safe from this risk, aren't they?
I really have no worries if my kid can remember breastfeeding. If he is still breastfeeding as a toddler or preschooler, we'll work on social boundaries of where I will and won't do that. Which is the real issue from that letter, to me, not a 5 year old breastfeeding.

Exactly what I'm talking about. Social boundaries. This mother is feeding something within herself at the, and yes, I might be extreme here, risk to her child.

I don't understand it, nor will I defend it. You can be pro-breastfeeding and scratch your head here, Token. It's okay.

And just so we're clear, no one's freaking out. It's just....a wee bit strange. And I think it's perfectly fine to call it that. Just like I think Michelle Duggar is welcome to have 10 more if she pleases. I can still side eye the H out of her, though

tokenhoser · November 2011

I'm probably becoming a LLL leader.

Just so we're clear how deep in the breastfeeding cult I am.

Not faking my lack of caring of other moms breastfeed a kid until the kid doesn't want to anymore.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

tokenhoser:
I'm probably becoming a LLL leader.
Just so we're clear how deep in the breastfeeding cult I am.
Not faking my lack of caring of other moms breastfeed a kid until the kid doesn't want to anymore.

Ding.

My kid wants to throw golf balls at the TV. But I don't let him. He also wants to eat chocolate all day. But, hey, it's called parenting. Sometimes we do whats best for our kids. Indifferent

And really, this has nothing to do with the kid, and everything to do with the mother's attachment issues.

Meismx, is this what you were looking for?

tokenhoser · November 2011

Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
I'm probably becoming a LLL leader.
Just so we're clear how deep in the breastfeeding cult I am.
Not faking my lack of caring of other moms breastfeed a kid until the kid doesn't want to anymore.
Ding.
My kid wants to throw golf balls at the TV. But I don't let him. He also wants to eat chocolate all day. But, hey, it's called parenting. Sometimes we do whats best for our kids.

You say what's best for your kid, not mine. Not hers. I don't really think you've got much backing you up, other than ancient Greek tragedies.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

tokenhoser:
Lisa Frank:
tokenhoser:
I'm probably becoming a LLL leader.
Just so we're clear how deep in the breastfeeding cult I am.
Not faking my lack of caring of other moms breastfeed a kid until the kid doesn't want to anymore.
Ding.
My kid wants to throw golf balls at the TV. But I don't let him. He also wants to eat chocolate all day. But, hey, it's called parenting. Sometimes we do whats best for our kids.
You say what's best for your kid, not mine. Not hers. I don't really think you've got much backing you up, other than ancient Greek tragedies.

Okey dokey then, Token.

Nighty' Night. Wink

sparkymcgeee · November 2011

What's best for her child may in fact be the breastmilk she is giving him. While I side eye the fact that she pulled it out in public and he nursed I don't side eye the fact that she still gives him breastmilk. She said he has an allergy. She has every right in the world to give him breastmilk if she so chooses. I just think she should pump if it's so important to her because I do think there are social and psychological issues that are cropping up.

Lisa Frank · November 2011

meimsx:
What's best for her child may in fact be the breastmilk she is giving him. While I side eye the fact that she pulled it out in public and he nursed I don't side eye the fact that she still gives him breastmilk. She said he has an allergy. She has every right in the world to give him breastmilk if she so chooses. I just think she should pump if it's so important to her because I do think there are social and psychological issues that are cropping up.

So, MOST of us agree.

Yay

kacelle · November 2011

I would be uncomfortable with this as well, but I can't put a finger on why. DH and I have had this conversation before, and neither of us really know why we cringe when we think about older toddlers and preschoolers still breastfeeding. Kids develop at totally different rates and some five years old may still need/want what breastfeeding has provided for them throughout their childhood.

I also don't get why people think that remembering breastfeeding would cause some major complex for kids. I just don't get it why anyone would believe that a child would be scarred by happy memories of their mother providing for their needs.

Would I breastfeed DD at five years old? Probably not. I have absolutely no desire to do so, and like I said, the thought does make me uncomfortable (though not because I think it would be damaging to her any way). But I think it would be selfish for me to reach my goal of two years and then force her to wean if she were obviously not emotionally ready at that point merely because she'd had her second birthday. There was a post on the AP board a few months back by a mother who was embarrassed to admit that she was still breastfeeding her 3.5 year old because he had developmental delays (I think he had been diagnosed with autism) and had an extremely difficult time with changes in routines. I can't judge a mom for doing what is best for her child's development, and she knows what that is better than I do. Maybe the mom in that article was using a milk allergy to cover up a similar reason for still breastfeeding at 5?

There's a good chance that none of that was coherent at all. It's late and I'm tired, but this is something I feel really strongly about. It's one of the only topics that I'll ever say "You shouldn't judge; just do what's best for your child" about. Goodness knows I love to judge.

kerrbear72 · November 2011

My only input is that the whole "milk allergy" thing is an absolute load of crap and if this lady wants to BF her 5 year old, she needs to just be a grown up and state that they both still enjoy the quiet time together or something along those lines.

If you're comfortable enough with whipping out a boob for a 5 year old in front of people, you need to be comfortable with what your true feelings/emotions are regarding it otherwise I think its very unhealthy for both mom and kid.

iris427 · November 2011

kerrbear72:
My only input is that the whole "milk allergy" thing is an absolute load of crap and if this lady wants to BF her 5 year old, she needs to just be a grown up and state that they both still enjoy the quiet time together or something along those lines.
If you're comfortable enough with whipping out a boob for a 5 year old in front of people, you need to be comfortable with what your true feelings/emotions are regarding it otherwise I think its very unhealthy for both mom and kid.

That's what I think too.

Whether or not 5 y/o's breastfeed in Mongolia, it is not the cultural norm here. A 5 y/o is well old enough to be aware of social norms and worry about what their peers think of them. So for that reason, yes, I think he could be in for some issues down the road. And I nursed my daughter for nearly 2.5 years, so I'm a big believer in extended breastfeeding.

tokenhoser · November 2011

iris427:
kerrbear72:
My only input is that the whole "milk allergy" thing is an absolute load of crap and if this lady wants to BF her 5 year old, she needs to just be a grown up and state that they both still enjoy the quiet time together or something along those lines.
If you're comfortable enough with whipping out a boob for a 5 year old in front of people, you need to be comfortable with what your true feelings/emotions are regarding it otherwise I think its very unhealthy for both mom and kid.

That's what I think too.
Whether or not 5 y/o's breastfeed in Mongolia, it is not the cultural norm here. A 5 y/o is well old enough to be aware of social norms and worry about what their peers think of them. So for that reason, yes, I think he could be in for some issues down the road. And I nursed my daughter for nearly 2.5 years, so I'm a big believer in extended breastfeeding.

Most kids that breastfeed that long are socially aware enough to do it in private. I will agree that it's weird he doesn't care that people think it's weird.

I don't put a lot of stock into north american ideals being best for kids, though. They're mostly based on 80 years of formula marketing and "experts" that told us if you hold a baby too much you spoil it.

And again, someone please find me a psychological journal article that gives the risks of breastfeeding past some arbitrary point where it goes from nurturing to damaging. If it's such a risk, there must be some case studies running around. If a boy gets an Oedipus complex, does it just make a girl gay?

deo · November 2011

I guess to each their own, but I would definitely judge in this situation.

I would also judge if she was still bottle feeding her 5 year old or offering the kid a pacifier. In my opinion a 5 year old is not a baby any more and at some point as a parent you need to help them grow up. I'm not sure what my cut-off age would be since each child is different but I definitely think that by 5 years old they are ready to be weaned, allergy or not.

ETA: I didn't read the article... just basing this off of PP.

bhilyer · November 2011

I know you ladies are having a serious discussion, but all I can think about is the scene from "Grown Ups" when the little boy tells his mom he wants some milk and she whips out her boob.

"How old is your son?"

"48 months"

"That's 4 years!"

Temp38995750004016 · November 2011

deo:
I guess to each their own, but I would definitely judge in this situation.
I would also judge if she was still bottle feeding her 5 year old or offering the kid a pacifier. In my opinion a 5 year old is not a baby any more and at some point as a parent you need to help them grow up. I'm not sure what my cut-off age would be since each child is different but I definitely think that by 5 years old they are ready to be weaned, allergy or not.

ETA: I didn't read the article... just basing this off of PP.

This is exactly what I think! And if she is still breast feeding due to an emotional or psychological need of his own...well, if I were in her shoes I would help him find ways we could provide that need that are more in line with our societal standards.

sparkymcgeee · November 2011

I know the title was controversy but I honestly didn't think people would argue about it. I really thought for the most part you guys would agree. And I'm having a hard time seeing where people really disagreed. Oh well. It livened things up a bit and it was nice to seem some not so regs come back.

Raquellyo · December 2011

Lisa Frank · December 2011

Raquellyo:

That's a good one. I haven't seen it before!

And your kid is cute

JNBrickey · December 2011

pook:
deo:
I guess to each their own, but I would definitely judge in this situation.
I would also judge if she was still bottle feeding her 5 year old or offering the kid a pacifier. In my opinion a 5 year old is not a baby any more and at some point as a parent you need to help them grow up. I'm not sure what my cut-off age would be since each child is different but I definitely think that by 5 years old they are ready to be weaned, allergy or not.

ETA: I didn't read the article... just basing this off of PP.
This is exactly what I think! And if she is still breast feeding due to an emotional or psychological need of his own...well, if I were in her shoes I would help him find ways we could provide that need that are more in line with our societal standards.

This is exactly what I think, too! Let's be real - if the mass majority of us saw a five year old with a binky, we'd all think he was way too old to have one. Even if it was just for "comfort." I'm all for breastfeeding and when I was pregnant I always said my goal was two years, but I think five is too long. If it is for comfort, find another way to comfort him (or yourself). If he has allergies, other ways do need to be found to deal with it because he can't nurse forever.

That being said, I have absolutely no familiarity with children's allergies, so, definitely not an expert on that (or even breastfeeding).

Raquellyo · December 2011

Lisa Frank:

Raquellyo:

That's a good one. I haven't seen it before!

And your kid is cute

Haha, it just felt right.... and thanks! She is a super happy (dare I say easy?) baby

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