Are infertile people annoying?

limpetfan · November 2011

Work is dead today, so I'm doing a little research for a blog post I've been thinking about writing. As I was Googling various topics, I came across this article:

Are Infertile People Annoying?

Before people get mad -- it's not what you think. The person who wrote this article seems to write predominantly about infertility, so she isn't saying infertiles are annoying. She's presenting her understanding of both sides of the question.

I thought it was an interesting read. I'm not saying I agree or disagree with a majority of the author's points... it was just interesting to see the arguments people have been known to make on this subject, so I thought I'd share.

Jezebell26 · November 2011

She raises excellent points and I personally think it is because many people are in the IF closet and are ashamed or embarrased to talk about it. I am not open to the public about my IF but my family and friends are aware, though some think i am just whining about wanting a baby. I honestly dont think most people can comprehend what it means to actually have trouble conceiving, or to need drugs and/or surgeries and procedures to help you conceive. In my experience a lot of people try to blame it on something I did or didn't do, ie my weight. If i would just relax and lose weight apparently i'd be a baby factory. Im sure my PCOS and 2 gene mutations have nothing to do with it. And yes, for some reason, a lot of people constantly ask me and MH if we are willing to adopt. Why? Am i not supposed to try everything humanly possible to have a biological child, even if its difficult or puts me through hell? Im not against adoption, we just haven't gotten there yet. I tell them we'll cross that bridge when we get to it, but that's definitely not the "cure" to IF!

Thanks for sharing!!!

brookelynpaisley · November 2011

Wow, what a reminder of the heartless and clueless things people say. THis one bothered me: "Infertile people act like it's their God-given right to have a biological child no matter what the cost - financially, emotionally or spiritually. They'd destroy their relationships and marriages in a desperate attempt to have children, as if its the only thing they could do to give their life meaning and value. Having children is not a necessary part of having and living a worthwhile life. Infertile people should realize this and let go of their unhealthy obsession with giving birth."

I would never put my marriage before having a baby. It's part of why we're not purusing treatment, because we don't want to put our marriage through that. Could we handle it? Yes. But the financial and emotional factors would take a toll and we're not ready or willing to drag ourselves though that right now for what we feel is a slim chance at success.

This shiit just makes me so angry. People who have children easily act like it's their given right to have kids, too. Why should we not fight for it? Why are we expected to adopt. Why are we not supposed to have the same emotional fulfillment of a biological child? People are assssholes.

ETA: some words

psubride1012 · November 2011

brookelynpaisley:
Wow, what a reminder of the heartless and clueless things people say. THis one bothered me: "Infertile people act like it's their God-given right to have a biological child no matter what the cost - financially, emotionally or spiritually. They'd destroy their relationships and marriages in a desperate attempt to have children, as if its the only thing they could do to give their life meaning and value. Having children is not a necessary part of having and living a worthwhile life. Infertile people should realize this and let go of their unhealthy obsession with giving birth."

I would never put my marriage before having a baby. It's part of why we're not purusing treatment, because we don't want to put our marriage through that. Could we handle it? Yes. But the financial and emotional factors would take a toll and we're not ready or willing to drag ourselves though that right now for what we feel is a slim chance at success.

This shiit just makes me so angry. People who have children easily act like it's their given right to have kids, too. Why should we not fight for it? Why are we expected to adopt. Why are we not supposed to have the same emotional fulfillment of a biological child? People are assssholes.

ETA: some words

. Couldn't have said it better myself. I heart U. (Eta - bump burp)

MsGMChick · November 2011

Jezebell26:
She raises excellent points and I personally think it is because many people are in the IF closet and are ashamed or embarrased to talk about it. I am not open to the public about my IF but my family and friends are aware, though some think i am just whining about wanting a baby. I honestly dont think most people can comprehend what it means to actually have trouble conceiving, or to need drugs and/or surgeries and procedures to help you conceive. In my experience a lot of people try to blame it on something I did or didn't do, ie my weight. If i would just relax and lose weight apparently i'd be a baby factory.

Very well said. Conception is such a "natural" and "easy" process for so many. Its programmed into us from a young age to not have sex because, "just once having sex leads to babies! so don't do it til later in your life." So when so many grow up, and sex does lead to babies, they don't comprehend what trouble means.

Anecdote- MH and I had dinner with 2 friends a few years ago. We were just about to start TTC. They made the announcement, "I'm PREGNANT!! YAY!" and then proceeded to tell us how they had TTTC- a whole 6 months trying ANDDD she used OPKs that last cycle. Sad, but the general population does see that as TTTC.

limpetfan · November 2011

brookelynpaisley:
Wow, what a reminder of the heartless and clueless things people say. THis one bothered me: "Infertile people act like it's their God-given right to have a biological child no matter what the cost - financially, emotionally or spiritually. They'd destroy their relationships and marriages in a desperate attempt to have children, as if its the only thing they could do to give their life meaning and value. Having children is not a necessary part of having and living a worthwhile life. Infertile people should realize this and let go of their unhealthy obsession with giving birth."

This shiit just makes me so angry. People who have children easily act like it's their given right to have kids, too. Why should we not fight for it? Why are we expected to adopt. Why are we not supposed to have the same emotional fulfillment of a biological child? People are assssholes.

That one ticked me off, too. I can't wrap my head around the idea that our decision to pursue having a child makes me selfish. The people who advocate adoption over fertility treatment usually have no idea how much adoption actually costs, or what's involved in going that route -- it's not like adoption is any easier.

This is the one that annoys me the most:

"Infertility is often the fault of a person's actions anyway - promiscuity, having abortions, or being otherwise abusive toward their bodies. I don't have any sympathy for them.Infertility is the result of making bad decisions and not taking care of one's body. Sexually transmitted diseases, obesity, multiple abortions, drug and alcohol abuse and waiting too late in life to try to have children all can contribute to infertility. Therefore we as a society should not have to treat people "special" because of their infertility, since they likely brought it upon themselves. Women should stop waiting until late in life to try to conceive and put family first."

Um... last time I checked, PCOS and poor morphology =/= something my DH or I have any control over. (I know Jezebell mentioned this one, too!) Even losing weight doesn't CURE PCOS. This is one of the biggest reasons I decided to go ahead and be open about our IF trouble -- I was a goody-two-shoes my whole life, and I still might never have a biological child. Shoots all kinds of holes in the whole "you-brought-it-on-yourself" theory, IMHO.

ETA: Sorry guys, I have no idea why that's so big, and I can't seem to change it!

Kathy4678 · November 2011

Holy Shiz. This is making me want to poke my eyes out. If you have never walked in my shoes or lived what I've lived- the STFU. Like right now. I didn't DO anything to cause this situation.

I think all people can be annoying- infertile or not. But HOLY SHIZ- this makes me angry.

MsGMChick · November 2011

limpetfan:

That one ticked me off, too. I can't wrap my head around the idea that our decision to pursue having a child makes me selfish. The people who advocate adoption over fertility treatment usually have no idea how much adoption actually costs, or what's involved in going that route -- it's not like adoption is any easier.
This is the one that annoys me the most:
"Infertility is often the fault of a person's actions anyway - promiscuity, having abortions, or being otherwise abusive toward their bodies. I don't have any sympathy for them.Infertility is the result of making bad decisions and not taking care of one's body. Sexually transmitted diseases, obesity, multiple abortions, drug and alcohol abuse and waiting too late in life to try to have children all can contribute to infertility. Therefore we as a society should not have to treat people "special" because of their infertility, since they likely brought it upon themselves. Women should stop waiting until late in life to try to conceive and put family first."
Um... last time I checked, PCOS and poor morphology =/= something my DH or I have any control over. (I know Jezebell mentioned this one, too!) Even losing weight doesn't CURE PCOS. This is one of the biggest reasons I decided to go ahead and be open about our IF trouble -- I was a goody-two-shoes my whole life, and I still might never have a biological child. Shoots all kinds of holes in the whole "you-brought-it-on-yourself" theory, IMHO.
ETA: Sorry guys, I have no idea why that's so big, and I can't seem to change it!

This is the one that pissed me off the most. MH and I were each other's first (awwwwww.. hey we met young LOL), so promiscuity is certainly not the cause of his MFI. But hey, I guess it IS my fault I was born out of my mom who had fibroids and endo. Silly me. All my fault.

eponine7682 · November 2011

limpetfan:
actions anyway - promiscuity, having abortions, or being otherwise abusive toward their bodies. I don't have any sympathy for them.Infertility is the result of making bad decisions and not taking care of one's body. Sexually transmitted diseases, obesity, multiple abortions, drug and alcohol abuse and waiting too late in life to try to have children all can contribute to infertility. Therefore we as a society should not have to treat people "special" because of their infertility, since they likely brought it upon themselves. Women should stop waiting until late in life to try to conceive and put family first."

UGH! Yeah, I don't think these things cause my DH to have very few sperm. People really just don't get it until they have known the pain and suffering.

The article did make me think about something that has been on my mind for a while though. I share a lot about our IF with a couple of my friends: 2 of which have no clue what IF is like, but listen and are very understanding (they don't have kids of their own yet) and the other has been dealing with IF a little longer then I have....Sometimes I wonder if I annoy them. It's not like that is all I talk about, but each time I see them I usually do update them on the latest. They don't seem to mind, but sometimes I wonder if the girls who don't deal with IF are sick of hearing about it, and the girl who is - I am just wondering if it hurts her to think about it more then she has to.

Anyways, sorry I got a little off topic, but this reminded me of how sometimes I actually do think I am annoying. lol

limpetfan · November 2011

eponine7682:

The article did make me think about something that has been on my mind for a while though. I share a lot about our IF with a couple of my friends: 2 of which have no clue what IF is like, but listen and are very understanding (they don't have kids of their own yet) and the other has been dealing with IF a little longer then I have....Sometimes I wonder if I annoy them. It's not like that is all I talk about, but each time I see them I usually do update them on the latest. They don't seem to mind, but sometimes I wonder if the girls who don't deal with IF are sick of hearing about it, and the girl who is - I am just wondering if it hurts her to think about it more then she has to.

Anyways, sorry I got a little off topic, but this reminded me of how sometimes I actually do think I am annoying. lol

I often wonder that myself. Since I'm open about what we're dealing with, people tend to ask me what's going on... and sometimes I wonder if they regret asking once I start telling them what is going on. That was part of why I read the article!

BabyDreams711 · November 2011

Wow, all I can say is this is very disturbing! i didn't realize some one out there had these views. I'm glad I have never heard anyone say something like this out loud, I would have had to b!tch slap them! But I guess that's why they posted it, everyone seems "stronger" behind a computer!

We do not discuss TTTC with anyone because we dont want to deal with family and friends asking us about stuff, we are private people. I am in no way ashamed. I am sorry I did everything right and still ended up with PCOS... The ones that get me are the religious ones saying God doesn't want you to have a baby... Unless God personally told them I am not good enough to have a child, they can shut their dirty little mouths! it's one thing to have your own f'd up opinion, but don't use your "religion" to justify your ignorance!

eponine7682 · November 2011

limpetfan:
eponine7682:

The article did make me think about something that has been on my mind for a while though. I share a lot about our IF with a couple of my friends: 2 of which have no clue what IF is like, but listen and are very understanding (they don't have kids of their own yet) and the other has been dealing with IF a little longer then I have....Sometimes I wonder if I annoy them. It's not like that is all I talk about, but each time I see them I usually do update them on the latest. They don't seem to mind, but sometimes I wonder if the girls who don't deal with IF are sick of hearing about it, and the girl who is - I am just wondering if it hurts her to think about it more then she has to.

Anyways, sorry I got a little off topic, but this reminded me of how sometimes I actually do think I am annoying. lol

I often wonder that myself. Since I'm open about what we're dealing with, people tend to ask me what's going on... and sometimes I wonder if they regret asking once I start telling them what is going on. That was part of why I read the article!

Yeah. I mean, if they ask, I would think they are truly interested. Most of the time my friends ask too, but sometimes I am the first to bring it up which makes me think this even more. lol. I guess since IF is on my mind about 98% of my day, I try really hard to make sure I don't talk about it too much so it's on everyone else's mind. But I do wonder if I bring it up too much at times.

brookelynpaisley · November 2011

limpetfan:
eponine7682:

The article did make me think about something that has been on my mind for a while though. I share a lot about our IF with a couple of my friends: 2 of which have no clue what IF is like, but listen and are very understanding (they don't have kids of their own yet) and the other has been dealing with IF a little longer then I have....Sometimes I wonder if I annoy them. It's not like that is all I talk about, but each time I see them I usually do update them on the latest. They don't seem to mind, but sometimes I wonder if the girls who don't deal with IF are sick of hearing about it, and the girl who is - I am just wondering if it hurts her to think about it more then she has to.

Anyways, sorry I got a little off topic, but this reminded me of how sometimes I actually do think I am annoying. lol

I often wonder that myself. Since I'm open about what we're dealing with, people tend to ask me what's going on... and sometimes I wonder if they regret asking once I start telling them what is going on. That was part of why I read the article!

Agreed. I try to be open because I don't want IF to be a shameful thing, and I feel that if I can be brave enough to be open, someone else may not feel so alone and may even have the courage to be open and spread the bravery. But reading this article definitely made me wonder if people have thought these things about me. I try very hard and am very conscious of not putting my issues on others. If someone's constant kid-related stuff on FB bothers me, I'd never dream of asking them to not share. I simply hide their feed if it's too much. I don't expect anyone to go out of their way to "protect" me. I feel that I'm more than capable of politely filtering and controlling what I see and acting appropriately with my emotions in 99% of situations. As far as the what we "should" do in terms of IVF and adoption, I think we should just be free to make our decisions. I don't tell other people how they should grow their family, and I don't think anyone has a right to tell me how I should grow mine. And don't get me started on insurance. I love how people think we shouldn't be covered for our health issue. I have a post on it in my blog that I think covers it pretty well

eponine7682 · November 2011

brookelynpaisley:
limpetfan:
eponine7682:

The article did make me think about something that has been on my mind for a while though. I share a lot about our IF with a couple of my friends: 2 of which have no clue what IF is like, but listen and are very understanding (they don't have kids of their own yet) and the other has been dealing with IF a little longer then I have....Sometimes I wonder if I annoy them. It's not like that is all I talk about, but each time I see them I usually do update them on the latest. They don't seem to mind, but sometimes I wonder if the girls who don't deal with IF are sick of hearing about it, and the girl who is - I am just wondering if it hurts her to think about it more then she has to.

Anyways, sorry I got a little off topic, but this reminded me of how sometimes I actually do think I am annoying. lol

I often wonder that myself. Since I'm open about what we're dealing with, people tend to ask me what's going on... and sometimes I wonder if they regret asking once I start telling them what is going on. That was part of why I read the article!

I don't expect anyone to go out of their way to "protect" me.

Yeah, I hear ya. I guess since I posted a week or two ago about my cousin not telling me his gf was pregnant until, well, when the baby was already here really made me think about how what I share may let people think that I don't want to hear any baby news. However, it hurts a lot more when people don't share things on purpose because they are scared of hurting me. I like to think of myself as a strong person, but it's sad that some people don't view me that way.

kellygksu · November 2011

The one about IF being the fault of the fertile couple and their past choices ticked me off the most too. Aside from a little too much wine.......I've basically been a goody-two shoes my whole life. Endo is not caused by any choices I made over the last 35 years.

bwe1100 · November 2011

Thanks for posting this - it was interesting and, as already mentioned, frustrating to read.

The focus for some research I've been doing academically has been the representation of IF in popular culture, and all too often it lines up with the negative stereotypes reflected by opinions in this article: the woman is at fault for waiting too long, is driven to acting hysterical, is a burden to those around her, is rarely having to do with male issues, etc. It's really disheartening to look at this stuff historically, and see how old tropes and stigmas persist.

Mrs.Slick · November 2011

I can't handle this today. ::bookmarks post to read later::

Ignorant people are annoying. End of story.

brookelynpaisley · November 2011

eponine7682:
Yeah, I hear ya. I guess since I posted a week or two ago about my cousin not telling me his gf was pregnant until, well, when the baby was already here really made me think about how what I share may let people think that I don't want to hear any baby news. However, it hurts a lot more when people don't share things on purpose because they are scared of hurting me. I like to think of myself as a strong person, but it's sad that some people don't view me that way.

Agreed. I think people assume that we're incredibly sensitive and breakable when it comes to any talk of babies. And I'm sure there are women like that out there. Heck, I'm sure even those of us who aren't usually that way have our days. I know I do. I general though, I don't want to be left out. I mean, have some mindfulness about how news is given, but generally, let ME sort out how I deal with it. I have this huge fear of being left out of activities with our friends who are parents because they don't have kids, thinking they're shielding us. But let US decide what is too much.

This is why I feel we need to be open and educate fertiles on how we feel, even if it's just specific to us. I feel like there's this idea when people find out about our IF that they did something wrong in announcing their pregnanct/posting pics/whatever. But how would people know to be sensitive if they didn't know to be? On the other hand, maybe it will ring a bell in people that you just never know and sensitivity is a good thing to have at all times. I don't know. I don't want to be treated any differently, and yet I think we can all be more kind because you never know what someone is facing.

Gah, I think I'm in need of a therapy sesh with all my excessive "talking" today Stick out tongue

jaguar2744 · November 2011

This is awful, even if she isn't speaking as if she believes this as fact, these responses that she has put out there are what people really do believe. I didn't chose this, I have tried to loose weight; maybe I haven't gone as far as to starve myself, but I love to eat too much, LOL. I guess that is what lengths this person expects us to go to, to "deserve" children.

candiryan39 · November 2011

Jezebell26:
She raises excellent points and I personally think it is because many people are in the IF closet and are ashamed or embarrased to talk about it. I am not open to the public about my IF but my family and friends are aware, though some think i am just whining about wanting a baby. I honestly dont think most people can comprehend what it means to actually have trouble conceiving, or to need drugs and/or surgeries and procedures to help you conceive. In my experience a lot of people try to blame it on something I did or didn't do, ie my weight. If i would just relax and lose weight apparently i'd be a baby factory. Im sure my PCOS and 2 gene mutations have nothing to do with it. And yes, for some reason, a lot of people constantly ask me and MH if we are willing to adopt. Why? Am i not supposed to try everything humanly possible to have a biological child, even if its difficult or puts me through hell? Im not against adoption, we just haven't gotten there yet. I tell them we'll cross that bridge when we get to it, but that's definitely not the "cure" to IF!

Thanks for sharing!!!

This!!

lincoln79 · November 2011

few people realize the red tape and many hurdles that go with TRYING to adopt. even if one does adopt, there is never any guarantee that the birth parent(s) won't change their minds.

financially, it doesn't make sense for us either. we have great infertility coverage (we are super blessed) but no coverage or financial assistance to adopt.

so while i agree that adoption is a great act, the practicality of the process needs much work imo.

sockii · November 2011

Hello everyone,

I am the author of the debate page that everyone is talking about here - I found this forum this morning while wondering why suddenly there was a huge surge in traffic to the page.

Some people seem to be upset that I even included the many hurtful arguments and things I've had said to me as a woman suffering from infertility. That was the impetus and primary point behind me creating the page in the first place, as I tried to explain in my introductory remarks and conclusions as well. I've written numerous articles about trying to raise infertility awareness and understanding, only to have people tell me to "just adopt" or that I was being "annoying" in wanting some compassion and sympathy for my situation. I literally have been ostracised from part of my extended family for writing on-line about how difficult it is for me to attend baby showers and similar baby-centric family events. I'm expected to just suck it up and deal, being in a large family where everyone celebrates each and every pregnancy to excess but has no compassion to share for those of us struggling just to have one child.

I was angry when I wrote the page and really did want to, perhaps, "shame" some of the fertile world out there into thinking twice about the assumptions they make about those of us dealing with infertility. Yet to make a balanced debate page, I had to present both sides of the argument, hoping it would show how ridiculous those points raised by the clueless fertile world really can sound. It's a tricky balance to strike, but I wanted to encourage others to speak up and let their voices be heard instead of being shamed into silence, which is something I'm so sick of myself at this point in my life.

Anyway, I just wanted to comment here to clear up any misconceptions about my intentions. I don't feel it does any good to ignore the hurtful comments often made against the infertile community - the only way to combat them is to look them straight in the face and point out how wrong and hurtful they are. And the more voices that speak up about infertility, the better. At least that's my point of view.

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