BF'ing help - please?

stargirl76 · July 2011

I'm confused. I know that it takes BM 3-5 days to come in, and that with c-sections it could take longer. How much longer? We're on day 6 and my supply is really low... for example, last night I pumped after 3.5ish hours and only got 0.5 oz of milk.
When we feed him, I usually put him on both sides for 15-20 min each, but he still gets really agitated and upset because he's still hungry. This started around night 2 or 3 in the hospital (I can't remember, it's all one big blur) when he was cluster feeding and I just didn't have enough. The pediatrician and the nurses told us to supplement with some formula to fill him up. So we've been doing that. Now his formula feeds are getting bigger (around 1.5 - 2oz each feed) -- and I don't know if it's because we're giving him more or he needs more food. He screams and cries and roots if we don't give him more, so I assume he's hungry...
I know that formula fed babies turn out fine, etc, etc but I wanted to breastfeed first if I could. I read online that our supplementing could be the cause of my low supply, and if that's the case, then I feel terrible and stupid for doing it -- but I don't want my little guy to go hungry, so I'm stuck.

Any advice? Thoughts? I'm at a loss for what to do and am coming to terms with having to supplement/formula feed if my milk doesn't come in soon. I just want to do what's best for him.

Sorry for the rambling novel; lack of sleep plus hormones don't make for a good combo.

vanilla15 · July 2011

I am sorry. Those 1st few days/weeks are a blur & confusing.

Can you nurse him (I think in the beginning we did 20 min on each side) and then after that supplement if you think you need to? I know they say that baby always gets more than the pump can so he maybe be getting more than .5oz. Also they said baby's tummy is so tiny in the beginning they really don't need very much which is why they eat so frequently. Do you have any LCs you can talk to? I know at my hospital they had a super accurate scale so you could weigh your baby before and after nursing just so you knew if he was actually getting anything? or maybe they would just be able to offer some advice?

in the meantime I would try the Mother's Milk tea & oatmeal. (some also swear by beer).

I hope this helps & try not to stress too much!

inamra · July 2011

I had serious supply issues in the beginning also, but for me, it was because I didn't nurse him enough in the beginning. And like you, I'd get 0.25oz at day 6. What I personally did was just keep on trying. I'd always try to nurse first, then pump while MH supplement-fed LO with formula. And we kept doing that and I made sure to drink A LOT of liquids and eat well--but mainly I would quench myself constantly throughout the day and have soups at every meal as well. Also, mrspresley gave me a tip that helped my supply when it dropped later on and it was to make sure I got enough calcium so I also took calcium supplements on top of drinking milk. To be honest, it was really hard to keep trying because it hurt so much and I was bleeding a lot and it was so disappointing everytime I pumped and barely got anything but I was thrilled when my milk finally came in. I think it was around day 9 or 10 for me and I didn't have a c/s. Good luck!

sanae78 · July 2011

If you can, I would try to decrease the amount of formula you are supplementing and just keep BF, even if it means he's on the boob constantly. That's what I did. We supplemented 20-30 ml after feedings (randomly, not every feeding) for a week and then I just stopped cold turkey because I was bound and determined to EBF. She never got another drop of formula after the first week because I didn't want to get into that cycle of having to supplement. The more you supplement, the more your body doesn't know that baby needs more milk. It's all about supply and demand. My supply wasn't great at first but I basically had her on the boob 24/7 for those first few weeks and then it was fine and I BF until 14.5 months. The first few weeks, seriously, she would be on the boob for an hour to an hour and a half (she'd fall asleep) then off for maybe an hour max. It was exhausting but I'm glad I pushed through it.

I agree, see an LC if you can. Maybe baby isn't latching properly. How is his weight gain for the first week? I was concerned because K didn't get back to birth weight until week 3, but then everything was fine.

Good luck and keep it up!

sanae78 · July 2011

PS. I only started to supplement because my pedi recommended it and it was my first baby so I didn't know any better. IF I ever have another baby I won't supplement and will just BF around the clock. A lot of times the docs & nurses are so quick to tell you to supplement when it's not really necessary.

stargirl76 · July 2011

sanae78:
If you can, I would try to decrease the amount of formula you are supplementing and just keep BF, even if it means he's on the boob constantly.

We tried really hard at the hospital to do that, but he would just constantly scream and scream and cry and I couldn't take it. What should I do if he's constantly screaming? If we don't supplement, he keeps unlatching and screaming, then gets more agitated and won't latch properly again...

lola808 · July 2011

Sorry, that must be sad and stressful. I think the others gave good advice, especially about keeping at it and supplementing after you nurse and pumping in between too. I could never pump much at all, but I know I wasn't starving him, so don't simply go by the amount you see. Some of us, even with Mother's Milk, oatmeal, loads of water, etc, still make "just enough."

BFing went OK for us, but we did supplement after his first pedi visit since his weight had dropped 10% since birth. Personally, I was totally fine with that. I BF till he was 10.5 months but at no time was it EBF... I wanted to do that initially, but I was not good about pumping regularly, so I did rely on formula when I was away from him. I don't think you should feel bad about that or think that supplementing a little now means that you won't be able to BF for the long run. Just keep at it and try your best to get your supply going... at the end of the day, though, as long as you're feeding and nourishing him, you're doing your job. Good luck!

lelekay · July 2011

First, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I know how awful it feels. What you describe is exactly how it was for us. From the very first week, he screamed and cried whenever we bfed. I tried so hard, bfing him round the clock and pumping, too. I never did make more than a few ounces a day. I agree with others' suggestions of trying to bf first, then supplement if necessary. I even tried to cut supplementing and force the bfing, but after a day and a half I couldn't let him scream like that anymore. Definitely keep at it and see a LC if you can. But you know your baby best. If you have to supplement, don't kill yourself over it. I ended up bfing plus supplementing for three months, then continuing to pump (very small amounts, but I held on as long as I could) for one more month after that. And while the guilt I felt when I let it go after that was awful, it was also such a relief. I could enjoy feeding my son and snuggle him while I fed him, instead of us both crying at feeding time.

Like I said, keep at it if it is important to you. It is worth giving it your all. But supplementing isn't the worst thing in the world. At least it wasn't for us. For us it was the better choice against all the screaming, kicking, and punching during bfing.

mrspresley · July 2011

I don't think I have much to add besides what all the others have said... it IS hard but hang in there! and know that most of us have all been there and know how you feel *hugs*

mrs.winter · July 2011

The pp gave good advice. Just hang in there, it will get easier. Keep at it and please don't beat yourself up. It's not worth it:)

MauiWedding08 · July 2011

keep at it, drink lots of fluids, and try not to stress (easier said than done) because that could be hindering the endorphines necessary to get the hormones figured out!!

MauiWedding08 · July 2011

And try to get some LC help! You could probably use some support and also help establishing a plan to wean away from the supplementing.

sanae78 · July 2011

stargirl76:
sanae78:
If you can, I would try to decrease the amount of formula you are supplementing and just keep BF, even if it means he's on the boob constantly.
We tried really hard at the hospital to do that, but he would just constantly scream and scream and cry and I couldn't take it. What should I do if he's constantly screaming? If we don't supplement, he keeps unlatching and screaming, then gets more agitated and won't latch properly again...

Hmm. Yeah, that's hard and it was the same way for us at first. I guest once we were past a week I was finally producing enough that she was ok. But pretty much the only time she wasn't screaming for like the first 6 weeks was when she was on the boob.

looking back, maybe she had reflux worse than I thought. See an LC and just keep trying. It's frustrating and difficult and A LOT of work, but you can do it! And we are here for you if you need support. So many of us have been there and we all have different stories. Lots of brains to pick! Keep it up!

SanHawaii08 · August 2011

lots of great advice already. only 2 things i have to add are - for the first few weeks, while you're establishing your supply, try not to go more than 3 hours w/o breastfeeding or pumping. and, 1/2 oz after 3.5 hr on day 6 is *totally normal* - you're doing great.

i ep'd (exclusively pumped) for the first month, so I know exactly how my supply ramped up. when E was in the NICU, I was told to pump 8x/day - i don't think i ever made it to 8, but I did do 7x/day. I made sure to pump every 3 hours during the day, and i would stretch it out to 3.5 or 4 at night, just to get a teensy bit of extra sleep. it was SO hard to get up in the middle of the night to pump, and not see much. my milk came in on day 5 (after a vaginal birth), and even then, it was only a little bit. i think on day 6, i was getting somewhere between 5-10mL (10mL = 1/3 oz) during each session, but it went up pretty quickly over the following weeks. so - 1/2oz right now sounds just about right!

keep it up, and your supply should increase. best thing to do would be as everyone else suggested - bf first (baby is more efficient than the pump - though maybe not right now, you're both learning right now! but he will be, over time), then follow up with the pumping.

bf is *hard*. for me, the biggest things to impact supply are not enough water and too much stress - the first is easy to fix, the latter is easier said than done! but keep at it, it will get better! i literally cried every.day. for weeks, due to pain, frustration, and sadness about bf'ing, but now we're at almost 9 months and going strong. it gets better!

vanceandlori · August 2011

sorry to hear that you're having such a difficult time. i have no advice for you but it seems like the ladies gave you some great words of wisdom already.

like christine said, loads of people have a hard time in the beginning with nursing and we all have our own stories. i made way too much milk the entire time i BFd-- no matter how much i tried to cut my supply down, it was persistent until i weaned her at a year. while that sounds like a "good" problem, it was NOT.

message me on facebook or call me (i'll send you my # later) if you want to vent or just get a load off of your chest. your little man is gorgeous and you guys are doing an amazing job thus far! &hearts;

HulaLove · August 2011

I'm so sorry you're experiencing this! BFing isn't easy and it often doesn't come naturally, so don't feel like you're a bad mom! You're both new at this!

I had supply issues at around 12 weeks and had to supplement Elyse. I wouldn't do it again. This time I plan on taking the prescription medication domparidone (I went on it at 11 weeks last time). It worked really well.

Other things you could try are: eating oatmeal, drinking LOTS of water, fenugreek or mother's milk tea.

The LaLeche League has a great website and I found their local rep to be AMAZING!!! The support was phenomenal.

If none of these things work, feeding your baby and taking care of your self are the most important things! Please don't beat yourself up if you supplement or only FF.

stargirl76 · August 2011

Thanks everyone for all the great answers! We've been really trying to push through and stick with BFing... like I told Lindsay in another post, we've really cut down on the formula supplementation because more milk has come in. Whether or not it's the full supply... I'm not sure? I'm engorged and sore after a few hours, but I haven't had any of that spurting stuff that everyone says I'll get.

I'm definitely feeling better about it all, so many thanks to you ladies! I think the postpartum blues also contributed to the helpless feeling, and that seems to have lessened a bit But our newest issues are gas and constipation which is a separate post...

sanae78 · August 2011

Glad it's getting better. It's SO hard! I don't know about spurting - I never really had that. I mean, I leaked a little but I don't remember it being a lot. Unless it had been several hours.

The baby blues are the worst, though. I remember crying every single day for the first 2 weeks or so. The bf struggles, the screaming baby, the sleep deprivation, the hormones - it's tough! It's like torture. But don't worry - it gets better. Everyone says that and you think, "really? when?" but it does. Hang in there!

stargirl76 · August 2011

sanae78:
The baby blues are the worst, though. I remember crying every single day for the first 2 weeks or so. The bf struggles, the screaming baby, the sleep deprivation, the hormones - it's tough! It's like torture. But don't worry - it gets better. Everyone says that and you think, "really? when?" but it does. Hang in there!

this exactly! sigh. a part of me wants to fast forward, but another part tells him to stop growing so fast!!

SanHawaii08 · August 2011

fwiw, i've never had the spurting - i thought that was only if you had an overactive letdown? if anything, my letdown is really slow =P and it takes forever between letdowns, which is why whenever i pump, i have to pump forever! 20-30 min, when other ppl are finished in 10.

i'm glad things are getting better!

HulaLove · August 2011

I never had spurting or really any leaking at all.

Plus it also took me FOREVER to pump even 6 oz. I think I MAYBE got 8oz once or twice.

I'm not looking forward to the bluesy phase after this next baby! It does pass though, try to keep telling yourself that.

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