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3rd Trimester
NBR: I told my husband to leave... long
I created another account because I don't really want anyone I know IRL to know who I am.
Some background: My husband and I did not discuss 'parenting' before we had our son (I am currently 37 weeks, and we have an almost 3 year old). I figured it would just be natural like everything else in our lives. I studied child development in school, am a teacher, and for many years was a behavior modification therapist. Needless to say, going in to being a parent, I had an idea of how to handle kids.
Tonight was the last straw. I have done a lot of 'work' to learn how to be the best parent I can be, and provide the best guidance for our child that I can. Despite my pleas my husband will not do ANYTHING- he won;t even watch freaking Supernanny, but will spend HOURS watching videos of crap on YouTube. I have asked for his input on everything, he always says whatever I want to do is fine, i.e. discipline, bedtime, tantrums, etc. So he gives me no input, which leaves the situation open for being my way (which I am completely open to it NOT being my way, but it has to be SOME way).
Our son will NOT stay in bed at night, so I decided what the plan would be to modify the behavior, and he agreed, except that he WON'T do it. He is anything but consistent which is only making the problem worse and then he complains and complains about our son not staying in bed.
I am the bad guy in the house. I am the threat, "if you don't go to bed, mommy is going to come in here" which breaks my heart. I dont want my son to fear me. I hate that I am always the one giving instructions and he is the one getting to play and have fun.
I feel like on top of having to teach my son how to be a good person, which I would not give up for anything, and teaching my students, and teaching myself how to be a decent mom, I have to also each my husband how to 1) be a grown-up, and 2) be a dad. Right now he is a playmate to our son.
Tonight I had enough when he spanked our son for not staying in bed (he had been walking him back to his room for over an hour- up and down, up and down. I lost it. I told him to get out, that if he wasn't willing to put in the work in being a parent that i didn't want him here. It would be easier for me to raise these kids on my own, rather than him pretending to be invested. He is here, he is present, he cleans, and he brings home a damn good paycheck, he doesn't drink or go out, has never cheated, has not done any of the things that most people would deem divorce worthy. Is not being the dad I think he needs to be- the dad I need him to be- worth throwing away my marriage?
We have already gone to a few couceling sessions, and he listens and takes their advice for a day or two, and then- again, out the window. I really can not imagine living the rest of my life having this same argument night after night, but I also can't imagine not being with my husband and taking him away from our son who adores him.
I really really do not know what to do and I feel like I can not talk to anyone IRL about this. What am I supposed to do? How do I fix it, or if not fix it, get over it and just let it go?
This discussion has been closed.
Re: NBR: I told my husband to leave... long
All I will say is, if this really happened, I do not think it is a good reason to ask your DH to leave. Parenting is a team effort and one or both of you will have to make compromises along the way. Sounds like you are the one making all the rules and is not willing to compromise so your DH probably gave up somewhere along the way because he would prbably rather not fight about it and just let you handle dicapline since you think you know everything it seems. Communication is key, and you are right you guys probably should have discussed parenting styles before having kids. Parenting is HARD WORK, it will take time and consistency, sounds like you two need to have a heart to hear (not a *** fest) and discuss how the two of you can tackle this together.
You also say you have gone to counseling, is your child part of the counseling sessions? If not he should be, that way you can find out better what may be triggering his behavioral issues. He could just be responding to your pregnancy and picking up on the fact that he wont be #1 priority soon. Talk to your kid, it may help too.
I'm really sorry that all of this is going on and you are dealing with a toddler and a pregnancy.
That said, I think that sometimes people with advanced education in the technicalities in child rearing and early childhood education, try to apply formal education to parenthood and therefore take over in parenting. Maybe your DH feels like he can't give you an opinion or input about raising your DS because you know best due to your career.
I don't think he is deciding just to not parent your children, I think he just doesn't know how to interject his ideas into your knowledge. Maybe you are intimidating him and now after 3 years he doesn't think he is capable of parenting your DS effectively, and with another LO on the way he is probably very overwhelmed by the entire situation and second guessing his ability to parent.
I completely understand your frustration, I really do. But, I think you may have let your anger get the best of you on this one. This is not an issue I would throw away a marriage over.
I had a similar problem with my H earlier in this pregnancy. I was reading voraciously about everything I could - the physiology of pregnancy, breastfeeding, parenting options, cloth diapers, etc. Everytime I would bring up one of these topics and try to discuss it with my H, he would get distant, sometimes frustrated, and end the conversation with "whatever you want, you know best" which wasn't what I was looking for.
I figured out after a couple of weeks that he felt overwhelmed with everything I was throwing at him and didn't have a chance to process it and form an opinion, so he literally had nothing to add to the conversation. So, I bought him a couple of books about pregnancy and parenting that were geared towards dads. No dice. He didn't read them.
It finally occurred to me that I've never seen my H pick up a real-life book. He reads constantly, but he uses the iBook application on his iPhone and reads during his rides to and from work everyday. So, I asked him if I could download a couple of books to his iBooks. He said sure. Lo and behold, he read them "cover" to "cover" and we had tons more to talk about.
You need to accept your H for who he is and work with how he learns things. You telling him what's going to happen is probably making him feel like an imbecile because you know so much more than he does. Help him learn in a way that he's comfortable with. Send him links to some YouTube videos about sleep training and see what happens.
But first, I would definitely apologize to him for kicking him out. That was uncalled for.
bingo! i would say that 90 percent of my friends are teachers. and i know from experience that teachers tend to take on the leading parent role.
now let me understand this. you were upset with your DH not taking on more of a parenting role, but when he did and spanked your son, after an hour of putting him back to bed, you were STILL mad at him because he spanked? so he's damned either way. i'm sorry, i really don't mean to be rude. but i think that asking him to leave was going overboard. i know that this was the final straw, but is he really doing something that is SO terrible??? does he beat you guys, cheat, lie, steal, party every night???
when our kids were little, i was ALWAYS the "lead parent", if you will. hubby had NO experience whatsoever even being around a baby/toddler. he was learning just as as i was, and i was very experienced. (FWIW, whenever i would ask him to read something about parenting, he would role his eyes at me and NEVER do it!) but as they got older, he got more involved. now there is sort of a shift, my older girls do everything with him. my 5 year old is attatched to me as i'm sure the new baby will be. i don't mind it. i know he loves us and this is what works for us. your oldest is still young. have faith that things will get better.
even though you (i'm guessing here) weren't happy that he spanked, you have to realise that it was a big step for him to be the "parent" when he repremanded your son. for you to be upset by that, you just took huge leaps backward with him and bruised his ego. men are weird that way. you critque them, they revert into childhood! i'm not going to debate spanking on here, that doesn't seem to be what this is about. but your DH obviously felt that this was warrented. as long as your son was safe, try not to overreact. maybe, thats what he needed;)
now, look at the positive to being the heavy! i completely love it! my kids know they don't pull their crap with me! BUT, they also know that i CAN be loving, kind, and fun too! please talk with him. don't disolve your marriage over this. he seems good, loving, and brings home a good paycheck. this is a partnership and each of you have different roles. and remember, just because you are educated, doesn't mean you can't learn;)
ok, so after writing my novel;) i went back to reread your post because i really feel bad for you guys. so when i got to this paragraph, bells went off. look at how you worded this! i think that any father/husband/male would be offended by this statement. sure, behavior mod. might be what you do in your proffesional life, but it doesn't mean that you always bring your work home! i know you said he agrees with whatever you advise, but to me, it sounds like you are almost a bit condiscending with him. (and btw, maybe the problem with your son isn't that your DH isn't consistant, maybe the "plan" isn't working?) try talking WITH your DH, not AT him. good luck!
First, I agree with you that parenting is a team effort. It takes both of your inputs to raise the children.
Your knowledge from reading books and helping other people with their kids does not make you the go-to person in raising everyone's kids including your own. Life is messy, kids screw up and so do parents. It's hard work every single day.
You need to cut your DH some slack. If I was your DH and I had been walking LO back to bed over and over and over and over again for more than an hour and all the "talks" weren't working...LO would have gotten a spanking from me as well.
In our house we do redirection, talking, taking things away and when all of those have been tried and they've failed then LO gets a spanking. Sorry if that doesn't live up to what your books tell you to do but some author who wrote them isn't in my house when I'm dealing with an unruly child.
In your situation you are laying way too much blame on your DH. Perhaps he's tired of not being as "perfect" as you are. You do seem to label yourself as the one who knows how to do everything and when DH doesn't do what you'd like based on how you would do it, he is immediately wrong and has no recourse.
How do you fix it? Realize that both of you are human. Realize that both of your make mistakes. Parenting isn't something that's handled by reading a manual or attending some college classes. Real life happens once the books are closed and that's when the decisions aren't based on something you read.
I say this because people who graduate the police academy always think they know everything. They might know enough to pass the state exam to get licensed and be hired as a police officer but the streets you patrol are messy and NEVER go according to the text books you read. That's when you have to improvise to keep from being killed. Common sense has to go along with all that knowledge you gained from reading the books in class.
If I were your DH and read this post about how you'd have to teach me how to be a grown up and knowing you just kicked me out of our marriage...I'd let you be a single parent, pay child support and do what is best for my kids. You don't see your DH as an equal, you view him as inferior and someone less than yourself. That is not a marriage and you're not being fair to him. You had to have seen these characteristics in him when you married him and now you think you're able to change him to suit what you think is best. That's just wrong on your part. Sounds like you might need to grow up a little bit.
Supernanny...lol.
And, I'm really sorry you're going through this, but clearly you're an educated woman. I think that maybe you and your husband should sit down and discuss your parenting plan and work on a way to do it together. Do you really want your marriage to end because you couldn't compromise? Parenting isn't always your way or the high way? You may be upset that he spanked your son, but you don't kick him out of the house.
Anyway, I hope this isn't MUD and I hope you two can work something out.
Braydon 1.23.09
First of all, I think some of this could be contributed to hormones, you are afterall 37 weeks pregnant! It's tough! I'm in the same boat and sometimes I feel like I release my wrath on DH too. I do agree that DH should be co-parenting with you. Perhaps he feels overwhelmed? Try and sit down with him and explain that you feel like this and would really appreciate his help and input. Try and figure out what's going on with him and his thoughts. I would however make sure that he understands that you do not support spanking as a method of discipline. It seems like maybe that was the final straw for you.
Hugs!!!!!
My DH is a very laid back guy, while I am a ?stressor?. What seems like the right way to me may not always be the right way to him. Also, I sometimes have the tendency to take over when I think things are not going right, when in all actuality, they are going right, it?s just not MY right. With that being said, are you willing to compromise and let your DH do things his way? Maybe he feels as if he cannot provide you with input because ?going in to being a parent, you had an idea of how to handle kids.?
I remember when my DD was younger I was determined to try the Ferber method. I had read about all of the success stories on the bump, and since she was not STTN, I was determined to make this my success story as well. DH told me from the beginning that he would not let DD CIO, but I refused to hear him out. Instead I argued my case and he reluctantly said OK. On day one, he picked her up 45 seconds into the first 5 minutes. I explained to him that he absolutely could not do that because he was ?messing things up?. He said ok, but did the same EXACT thing the next night. I felt like he was ruining my hard work, but never once did I go back and reflect on him telling me from the beginning that he did not agree with the method. Eventually we talked about it, as parents should, and decided that the CIO approach was not for us. Although I would have loved to continue using Ferber, my DH was not comfortable with it, so I had to compromise. I think you need to do the same with your husband. If was walking your DC back to bed for over an hour, maybe he felt as if that approach was not working, so he tried it his way. Because you are not open to even listening to what he feels is the right way to do things, you threw him out. Do you now understand why he tells you to do whatever you want?
Raising children is very hard work. It?s definitely the most challenging job I have had thus far. Although I would love it if all of my desires were met, the truth of the matter is that my method does not always work. Sometimes it takes my laid back DH to get things done with DD because she sometimes likes his approach better. It does not make you the ?bad? parent and him the ?fun? parent. It makes both of you parents that are doing what is best for your child. Can you imagine how your child?s life would be if that balance was not there? I know that my DD definitely needs that balance, because I am too serious at times and I need my laid back husband to lighten the mood for her.
I think you and your husband should seek counseling again, but this time, don?t talk about the baby. The first thing you need to address is your ability to compromise with each other. Once you can learn how to do that, then you can discuss parenting styles listening to both point of views. This will help everything. Either way, I am completely against divorce unless there is infidelity or abuse present, so you need to work it out. ?Irreconcilable differences? is why the divorce rate is so high, and it is why marriage is no longer taken seriously in this country!
Thank you everyone for you advice/ opinion. I assure you this is not MUD, I wish it were Let me clarify a few things. First being that our son is very well-behaved. Normal toddler defiance is our biggest issue, along with bed-time. He really is a great kid, he's happy, smart, and that is all I really want for him. I just am constantly worried over the future and what is going to happen when he sees that there is an inconsistancy. I don't want him to turn in to the teenagers I see everyday.
I realize that my education is not the end all be all in raising our children. I would be overjoyed to have him take some of the responsibility off my shoulders. We have talked at length about what we would do, as parents, in a certain situation- like, when is spanking ok, when to use something else, how long we will try before switching to something else, etc. In each of these conversations I have pleaded for his input and opinion, he knows it does not have to be my way. I am happy to do it his way or a compromise of the two. I have asked for his help, I have asked in counselling for his help, and i always get a "I will help, I promise" and that will last a day or two, and then everything goes right back to the way it was.
I also realize that Supernanny is just a tv show and not a guide book, but at this point it is better than nothing. I have sent him numerous Youtube links, I have ask him to watch them with me. I have bought him books that he promised to read, nothing. I have bought videos that he promised to watch, nothing. All of this just so he will see that we need to have some plan, even if it isn't mine. He won't put in the work. THAT is what bothers me the most. I would be happy if he came up with ANY idea, on his own, from a book, a video, ANYTHING.
I know that asking him to leave was overreacting, but last night was just all i could take. I want a partner in this, not someone who fakes it or who can not have a discussion about our family.
I guess the real issue is that I feel like I am doing all of the "raising" and he is doing all of the playing. He gets to have fun and enjoy our son 100% of the time and I feel like I only get to do that 50% of the time because I am trying to compensate for what H does not do. I don't want my son to end up hating me because I was always the one disciplining him or enforcing the rules, while H sits back and makes silly faces behind me while I am doing it.
I am going to say this in the nicest way, because I can empathize. You need to let go of this worry about the future. There is NO WAY you can guarantee the outcome you want for a child when you are dealing with the human factor. You can do everything perfectly as a parent, but unless you never let your child out of the house, there will ALWAYS be outside influences that you can not control. All you can do is hope and pray that you raised him with the tools to make good decisions, and that he has a good line of communication with his parents. If you are constantly worried about the what if's, even if your DH was involved like you wanted him to, you will STILL miss out on the fun. And I can say this, because I was there. I have been in counseling for seven years, and this is STILL hard for me, but I am constantly reminding myself that life is out of my control; especially how my children turn out.
My brother and I were raised in the same house with the same rules, same boundaries. I never rebelled, went to college, got married. He became an alcoholic and drug addict. Neither of us blame our parents for that. We were given the same tools knowing we came from a family of addicts, and he is open with us and told us chose not to use them (thankfully he is clean and has been sober for over a year). Of course this is an extreme, but what I am trying to say is that you can't prevent the actions someone will make when they are at an age to make their own decisions.
I have packed mine and DD's bags before in moments of high tension with DH...it happens. I have even brought up the "we never should have gotten married" line. But we talked it out. We both realized we were harboring past hurts, and holding onto things that happened long before we ever met, so it made us more defensive. I suggest individual counseling in addition to marriage counseling. It might give him the strength to be more open with you, and it might help you let go a little.
I really hope things turn out. I think there is a lot more to this than parenting, and when you fix things on that deeper level, it will be easier to overcome what is on the surface.
Good luck to you!!
First of all I dont think the teens that you deal with everyday who are unruly are that way because of inconsistant parenting, it's probably because they have no parenting. So you shouldnt be worried that the inconsistancy you guys have right now is going to turn your child into a juvenile deliquent. My H and I sometimes have different approaches to what is good for LO. But we talk it out. I think you should apologize for kicking him out and wait until after you have this baby for your hormones to level out before you make any rash decisions. What you feel now may not be how you feel after you have your baby.
I would keep going to counseling and wait until you are not pregnant to make any decisions. I don't think personally this is the end of your marriage, just a rough spot.
I know this time around I have been more emotional, sensitive, and up and down and have been blowing things up that aren't that bad with my DH. I'm sure he can't wait for me to be back to normal.
Not to say you aren't right or should feel the way you do, I would just let your hormones relax and keep working on the problem areas before you make any big decisions.
Natural M/c 12/13/08 at 8w5d
I agree with this. Though I can sympathize with your frustrations on your H not taking action, it sounds like there's just more work that needs to be done. Please do not let your hormones get the best of you, you said yourself he is a good husband. Maybe once the LO gets here, he will be able to take a more active role in your child's discipline because you will have to care for the new LO. Also, could the arrival of your new LO be the reason your child is acting this way?
It sounds like you are very educated, have a big heart, and want to do everything to give your family the best it deserves, but it sounds like your H maybe needs a little more leeway than you have been giving him. He might take the attitude that "you're the professional, you know best" and that's why he has been the way he is. I know that we do this all the time. Since child development is basically your career, you are obviously very interested in it...but that doesn't mean it comes naturally to him. He may be afraid to act because it might not live up to your expectations...which is what happened here.
Don't give up on him...
while i'm hugely anti-spanking and think you probably have the right idea in terms of parenting, i think you overreacted quite a bit.
my H had zero experience with children before we had our own, but he pretty much leaves most things up to me b/c i'm more comfortable with it. now, he will be consistent and work with me, but i'm the rule maker in the house. we both are the disciplinarians
this would not be a deal breaker for me. your H doesn't sound like an awful guy and to be honest i think watching super nanny is hysterical. sure, read up on some things here and there for different/new methods if something isn't working for you, but that *** is boring and most parenting is common sense.
you just sound way to controlling and rigid about this and lecturing your H on how "educated" he is on the topic is probably pushing him away.
IM humble O
I think you just need to suck it up and deal with him and his inadequacies. You married and committed to him and personally I've just always thought that women are responsible for raising the kids cause we are just so much better wired for the job. Men are stupid and incompetent but you committed to him and now it's time to shirt up and honor that commitment. Welcome to being a woman! Dealing with men! ARG! I know how much this sucks to hear and is annoying because it's what my mom and BFF tell me every time I want to complain about DH.
I'm confused. You want your husband to help parent and then when he tried to help you kicked him out. If your child is consistently getting out of bed and nothing else is working, I see nothing wrong with a spanking. Many parents choose to do that and it works for them. Maybe you need to reflect on instances in the past where you may have asked for his help but then been unhappy with the results, which caused him not to want to help at all.
This is why parenting styles have to be discussed before you have kids. Maybe your husband wants to spank. Maybe he honestly does want to leave the decisions about the kids up to you. My husband does both of those things and it works greats for us. But if it isn't working for you I would suggest counseling before you throw him out of the house with a baby due at any moment.
I am sorry you're going through this, but I have a feeling this was a rash decision made by a very pregnant, hormonal woman. You're going to regret this very soon and I hope your husband is man enough to forgive and move on.
::looks around::
did I just time travel to the 1950s?
This is not going to be popular, but it needs to be said.
Welcome to being a mother to small children. I just know for me and many other mothers this is just the way it is and has been since the beginning of time. The baby/infant/toddler years are our hardest years of work because we are hardwired with the ability to take care of small babies. Many men just don't know what to do and honestly don't care to do it. It's not that they don't love their babies, it's just that it isn't what they are hardwired to do. They are wired to go out and provide for their families (something you said yourself that your husband does a wonderful job of doing).
This doesn't mean a husband should be absent completely, because they should still be around as a strong male role model, backing up the mother in the decisions se makes concerning the children and supporting her where she needs it.
If potty training had been left up to my husband my kid would have been swimming in a pile of his own pee and poop for three months. He wouldn't know how to start it and he wouldn't know how to follow through. I did that hard work because I have the patience and understanding of small children to handle it. My husband doesn't wake through the nights with my babies because he has to wake up early and go to work. I want him to have a full night of sleep because I get chances to rest during the day at home - he doesn't.
But my husband is still active in other ways - showing my children what it is to bve a man, teaching them about God and what He would want them to do in certain situations, etc.
And then one day my children will be much older and the burden of care will start to fall more on my husband. Once everyone is able to take care of their own physical needs, I'm going to be resting while my husband is stressing about teaching his sons everything they need to be taught and keeping any daughters we have from seeking attention from other men because he isn't doing his job.
It all evens out.
I think sometimes in our feminist society we forget that no matter how much we try to break the "mold" to fit what we want it to, there are just certain things that are innate. When we try to change the natural order of certain things, this is when problems arise. When we put female expectations on our husbands it's no wonder they can't live up to them. Sure there are some men who like taking care of children, but it is definitely not the case for most men.
You two need to talk. If not for the sake of your marriage, for the sake of your cildren. Because even if you separate or divorce, there are still two parents who need to be consistent in all parenting decisions.
Good luck. I will pray for your family.
This is what I was thinking! Maybe I'm lucky but my H is neither stupid of incompetent, I wouldn't of married him if he was.
OP, I agree with others that you should seek counseling and discuss in greater length child rearing goals/plans etc. As you know consistency is very important for LOs and it's important to all involved that you and your H are on the same page. I do think you overreacted greatly, but I do understand that it's not really that one action that caused it but what broke the camels back.
This whole thread is so unbelievability effed up I just don't even know where to start.
Maybe here :
The Mouse ~ 06.12.08 | The Froggy ~ 02.23.11
i can see both sides to this. i think it's a perfect storm of you being a bit overbearing and not just letting loose to have fun now and then and your H not wanting to be the disciplinarian.
sure we have consistency and rules in our house that my H and i both enforce, but you know sometimes after a long day at work we bend our own rules a bit and have fun and i don't worry about it one bit. having super rigid expectations and rules would never work in my home. and my kid behaves fabulously for the most part.
i do agree with AW that you guys to need to have a real sit down, come to jesus talk about backing each other up - even if I discipline in a way my H doesn't agree with, he always, always backs me up in front of DD, then he will discuss it with me later that he thought I was too soft or too hard considering the situation. and i do the same with him. i would never reprimand him and especially not in front of DD since he's also the parent and has just as much right to enforce what he thinks is appropriate, kwim?