a pt #2 question-long, but i'm at a loss

aprilprincess · December 2010

So Addie just turned 4. Up to this point she has been pt for #1 since January 2010. She will not poop on the potty. She waits all day until she gets her pull up at night then she goes in there.

We talked it up big time, that when you turn 4 you get to poop on the potty. We even said they make special pull ups for only pee for big girls (she wakes up soaking wet so I'm not going cold turkey on the pull ups). She was happy and helped us pick out the pee only pull ups (toy story or the other "boy'' styles). The first night I caught her when she had just started to poop in her pull up and rushed her to the toilet. We made a huge deal about what a big girl she was, so excited, etc etc. I even gave her a sparkly piggie bank as a prize. DH and I told her she'd get a dollar everytime she went on the potty. After she got $10 we could go to target and pick a new toy.

Night 2, talked up the dollar, encouraged, cheered etc all day about how we were going to do it at night. caught her again starting in her pull up, rushed to the potty and she got a dollar.

night 3 nothing, she sat on the pot and tried.

night 4, nothing thought she sat on the pot and tried

night 5, dh caught her, tried to run to the potty, flung it on the floor instead. awesome. but we dropped it in the potty (discussing how it's where poop goes), cleaned up and went on.

night 6 nothing, but she tried.

today she has to go, we sat on the pot for 30 minutes, tried starting in a pull up, tried reading, distracting, focusing, etc. nothing ever happened

so what would you do? how can you encourage and make it happen without pushing? The kid is very regular,so to go a couple days without it is unheard of for her. I just dont know what to do next.

savannah11 · December 2010

While we did not have this specific problem we had a lot of problems PTing O, especially #2. I think I posted on here a couple of months ago about a full regression we had where nothing worked. He would also swing between constipation and going multiple times a day just to receive a prize and ultimately making himself hurt because of it which led to giving up the potty completely.

What we finally did was take away all the positive and negative pressure. I took away all the rewards and all the punishments. We didn't make a big deal about or even tell him we just stopped talking about it. I had made the conscious decision to put him back into pull ups full time and try again later. Well, as soon as we took away the pressure the accidents stopped. I think it was all too much for him to handle. He needed to do it on his own.

My guess is Addy is feeling anxiety due to you and DH making such a big deal out of the potty lately and is holding it in. Maybe back off for a day or two to get her going again and then try again. I know it's hard when you feel your kid is old enough and should be getting it but is not. That was one of the most frustrating things for me.

LisaK2b · December 2010

I honestly think that everything that you're doing is right and you just need to continue and hopefully one day in the very near future...it just "clicks" for her and then the rest is history. Like with everything else, I noticed that kids can pretty much change over night sometimes and get what they need to do. Just keep up the good work and stay patient.

Nanner · December 2010

I tend to agree with savannah, especially since she's 4. You're past the reward phase, especially since you've said she hasn't really been responding to it. Is she having any kind of problem at preschool? Extra stresses at home?

Anyway, with our constant PT issues with Hannah, last night I picked up my Potty Training for Dummies book that I hadn't even looked at since we first started training. There are some chapters toward the back that deal with regression and defiance. Since you say Addie is very regular, I would think that she is struggling with control issues.

Among other things they suggest is, as savannah said, let go a little bit. No more pressure, no more prizes, no more over-the-top celebrating. It is what it is. They also suggest to look at your parenting regimen. Do you make too many choices for her, be it with clothes, playing, TV, food? Do you give her lots of orders throughout the day? (And when I say you, I mean you OR DH.) Do your expectations exceed what Addie (or any 4-year old) is capable of? If so, this lack of control in other areas may be adding to the poop problem. It's the whole control thing, just like it is when they're first learning.

And if all else fails, for kids Addie's age and older, they suggest giving the child total responsibility for potty training. Show her that she IS in control of her body and what it does. Here's an excerpt:

You're no longer her keeper. You are putting her totally in charge. So step back and wish her well. "I think I'll let you decide when you want to go to the potty. You're a good girl. I know you can figure it out." Caution outside caregivers and relatives -- "no reminders or pressure." ...

Expect to feel very, very antsy when it's time to put your small fry on her own. And, don't think you'll be able to do this without a few qualms. Responsible parents won't find it easy to let go and give the child responsibility for herself and her potty practices...Basically, you're butting out...

Basically, have a talk with her to tell her that you're backing off and giving her space to learn. Then do it. It has some specifics on what to do when she slips up, has accidents, etc. (Basically show her how to take care of the messy underwear--yeah, I know--and clean herself up. If she's a mess and needs help, you can put her in the tub, turn on the water, and teach her how to clean herself.)

Anyway, that turned out way long, but I thought I'd share that approach with you.

aprilprincess · December 2010

Nanner:

I tend to agree with savannah, especially since she's 4. You're past the reward phase, especially since you've said she hasn't really been responding to it. Is she having any kind of problem at preschool? Extra stresses at home?

Anyway, with our constant PT issues with Hannah, last night I picked up my Potty Training for Dummies book that I hadn't even looked at since we first started training. There are some chapters toward the back that deal with regression and defiance. Since you say Addie is very regular, I would think that she is struggling with control issues.

Among other things they suggest is, as savannah said, let go a little bit. No more pressure, no more prizes, no more over-the-top celebrating. It is what it is. They also suggest to look at your parenting regimen. Do you make too many choices for her, be it with clothes, playing, TV, food? Do you give her lots of orders throughout the day? (And when I say you, I mean you OR DH.) Do your expectations exceed what Addie (or any 4-year old) is capable of? If so, this lack of control in other areas may be adding to the poop problem. It's the whole control thing, just like it is when they're first learning.

And if all else fails, for kids Addie's age and older, they suggest giving the child total responsibility for potty training. Show her that she IS in control of her body and what it does. Here's an excerpt:

You're no longer her keeper. You are putting her totally in charge. So step back and wish her well. "I think I'll let you decide when you want to go to the potty. You're a good girl. I know you can figure it out." Caution outside caregivers and relatives -- "no reminders or pressure." ...

Expect to feel very, very antsy when it's time to put your small fry on her own. And, don't think you'll be able to do this without a few qualms. Responsible parents won't find it easy to let go and give the child responsibility for herself and her potty practices...Basically, you're butting out...

Basically, have a talk with her to tell her that you're backing off and giving her space to learn. Then do it. It has some specifics on what to do when she slips up, has accidents, etc. (Basically show her how to take care of the messy underwear--yeah, I know--and clean herself up. If she's a mess and needs help, you can put her in the tub, turn on the water, and teach her how to clean herself.)

Anyway, that turned out way long, but I thought I'd share that approach with you.

ok, that all makes sense. one question, can i keep putting her in the pull up at night? since she wakes up wet i have no problem with that, but I wonder if it works with letting them take control.

she doesn't have poop accidents during the day, she just waits for nighttime. We haven't really mentioned it in a year and she's totally ok with waiting for a pull up at night. so we can continue letting her be in control but what will make her give it up one day?

aprilprincess · December 2010

Nanner:

I tend to agree with savannah, especially since she's 4. You're past the reward phase, especially since you've said she hasn't really been responding to it. Is she having any kind of problem at preschool? Extra stresses at home?

Anyway, with our constant PT issues with Hannah, last night I picked up my Potty Training for Dummies book that I hadn't even looked at since we first started training. There are some chapters toward the back that deal with regression and defiance. Since you say Addie is very regular, I would think that she is struggling with control issues.

Among other things they suggest is, as savannah said, let go a little bit. No more pressure, no more prizes, no more over-the-top celebrating. It is what it is. They also suggest to look at your parenting regimen. Do you make too many choices for her, be it with clothes, playing, TV, food? Do you give her lots of orders throughout the day? (And when I say you, I mean you OR DH.) Do your expectations exceed what Addie (or any 4-year old) is capable of? If so, this lack of control in other areas may be adding to the poop problem. It's the whole control thing, just like it is when they're first learning.

And if all else fails, for kids Addie's age and older, they suggest giving the child total responsibility for potty training. Show her that she IS in control of her body and what it does. Here's an excerpt:

You're no longer her keeper. You are putting her totally in charge. So step back and wish her well. "I think I'll let you decide when you want to go to the potty. You're a good girl. I know you can figure it out." Caution outside caregivers and relatives -- "no reminders or pressure." ...

Expect to feel very, very antsy when it's time to put your small fry on her own. And, don't think you'll be able to do this without a few qualms. Responsible parents won't find it easy to let go and give the child responsibility for herself and her potty practices...Basically, you're butting out...

Basically, have a talk with her to tell her that you're backing off and giving her space to learn. Then do it. It has some specifics on what to do when she slips up, has accidents, etc. (Basically show her how to take care of the messy underwear--yeah, I know--and clean herself up. If she's a mess and needs help, you can put her in the tub, turn on the water, and teach her how to clean herself.)

Anyway, that turned out way long, but I thought I'd share that approach with you.

ok, that all makes sense. one question, can i keep putting her in the pull up at night? since she wakes up wet i have no problem with that, but I wonder if it works with letting them take control.

she doesn't have poop accidents during the day, she just waits for nighttime. We haven't really mentioned it in a year and she's totally ok with waiting for a pull up at night. so we can continue letting her be in control but what will make her give it up one day?

Nanner · December 2010

Have you ever tried it? I would definitely give the no-pull up thing a try for a week or so and see how it goes. Put on a waterproof pad, mentally prepare yourself for doing a huge amount of laundry, and see how she does. If you don't already, restricting liquids after dinner.

Let me know how it goes! I can't wait until we're done with this. PTing Hannah has been our Mt. Everest.

michellebelle · December 2010

Nanner:

Have you ever tried it? I would definitely give the no-pull up thing a try for a week or so and see how it goes. Put on a waterproof pad, mentally prepare yourself for doing a huge amount of laundry, and see how she does. If you don't already, restricting liquids after dinner.

Let me know how it goes! I can't wait until we're done with this. PTing Hannah has been our Mt. Everest.

We started this on a weekend with Maddie. Had a couple of spare sets of sheets ready to go and a waterproof mattress cover. When she soaked the bed, we changed her, the sheets, etc. and then put her back to bed. We were prepared for 3 changings a night and never had more than 1.

Really getting rid of the pull-ups is what it took to make her poop in the potty. She did not like poop in her big girl panties.

Also, peer pressure helped. Is she in pre-school? If she's not, you might consider it. All her friends pooping on the potty made M want to do it too.

Nanner · December 2010

michellebelle:

Really getting rid of the pull-ups is what it took to make her poop in the potty. She did not like poop in her big girl panties.
Also, peer pressure helped. Is she in pre-school? If she's not, you might consider it. All her friends pooping on the potty made M want to do it too.

For us, unfortunately big girl panties and preschool have not phased Hannah. The teacher actually wrote a note home yesterday saying they wanted to have a chat about Hannah's "toileting habits." Sigh. But I really do think it's because she has constipation problems. It's something in her diet, I'm sure, but we just haven't figured it out yet. We're thinking milk or highly acidic fruits, but nothing has made itself obvious yet.

(Sorry to hijack your thread, aprilprincess!)

michellebelle · December 2010

Well I feel for both of y'all because the poopie panties really drove me crazy this time last year!

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