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Adoption
sillygirlio
member
Women who've never been PG - question about the sense of loss.
sillygirlio
member
in Adoption
Ok, what I'm about to say is totally flamable if you've suffered a miscarraige, but please know that I don't mean it to be flamable, there is no other way to say what I want to say.
With that out of the way... I'm having a problem and hope that some of you ladies can give guidance or atleast relate. DH and I were ttc for four years and recently went on a "break" that could prove to be the end of the TTC road for us. Adoption may be in our future, but we're not sure... I need some time to heal, and I still have dreams of a bio child.
Anyway, I'm suffering from a tremendous sense of loss and I'm struggling with what to do with these feelings. I have tried to reach out to a few friends IRL (almost everyone knows about our IF) to tell them about how I'm mourning our "baby" which would be 3 now if we'd conceived it when we started ttc (like most normal couple do) and they've pretty much all come back with something about how I have nothing to mourn because I was never pregnant to begin with, and I need to get over it.
Now I'm struggling with this because my friend (who has had 4 easily achieved pregs and three lovely children... one PG eneded in a loss) is acting as though I've never lost anything and that SHE'S the one who has the market cornered on pain because of her miscarraige.
It's to the point where I almost wish I had had a loss (this is the part that is flamable. I don't actually wish to have a miscarraige... and I know this is a horrible thing to say, and I'm sorry to all the women reading this who have had to suffer through that... but it's the way I feel right now) so that someone would take my pain seriously! When my friend had her loss people sent flowers and cards and mourned with her... but I feel like I'm mourning alone.
I tried to tell her (and other friends who've given me the same kind of story) that I see my "fantom" three year old child everywhere... they are always not with me... we didn't take them trick-or-treating last week... we won't be buying Christmas presents for him/her... and we don't get to see them grow up, play sports, or graduate from Highschool... but they look at me like I'm crazy!
Do any of you know what I'm talking about, or am I really crazy? Also, are there any boards that you know of for women recovering from IF but not yet to the adoption stage? I think I need something like that right now.
This discussion has been closed.
Re: Women who've never been PG - question about the sense of loss.
Welcome.
I don't think your post is flamable. And I totally get what it's like to mourn the loss of a biological child. I tried to explain it to my sister in a way that made sense (to me) and she totally didn't get it either. I think because it's not a tangible thing to lose people just don't understand.
Having biological children is something that the majority of people just don't have to think that much about. And I really do think IF is something that unless you've BTDT is just about impossible to fully understand. It encompasses so much of our lives that it's hard to articulate the feelings of dispair and hopelessness that come along with it.
I'm sorry you are struggling with things. You AREN'T crazy. I still think about it every single day and wonder if the pain of IF will ever get easier. Or if I'll still find it as painful when I'm 50 as I do right now. It has been the hardest thing I've ever experienced in my life.
Have you considered a going to a RESOLVE meeting in your area? You might find it helpful to talk to others who are in the same place as you. Or post on the IF board here. The women there totally understand too.
Best wishes and feel free to post here too!
I can completely relate not to mention have a pretty similar story. We have been TTC since November of 2005 with a 15 month break from my DH being in Iraq.
DH and I have always talked about adoption from the beginning and both of us have had it in our heart. DH's best friend and his twin brother are adopted so it's never something we were "closed" off to. However, finances have led us to a different path (foster-adopt).
I still mourn at various times of the pregnancy that I will never have. The child that will never have my or DH's eyes, hair color, nose, etc....
You definitely have something to mourn and your friends should be ashamed for making you feel otherwise. However, people that have biological children will NEVER get that.....I'm sorry people but it's the truth. They will NEVER truly get how you feel even if they've adopted AND have a biological child. I wish it were different and even people that have had a miscarriage can't understand what it's like for a woman that has NEVER gotten pregnant (me). I have also said at times that (God forbid) I WANTED to have a miscarriage just so I could know that things somewhat worked. Yes, I know it's stupid and illogical but that's how I feel.
Please know you aren't alone and please feel free to message me. I have tried to "healthily" (not sure if this is a word) to move on. Some days I see multiple pg women and it all comes flooding back that it will never be me! My difference between most women grieving this loss is that I grieve the actual pregnancy feelings and not the biological child, if that makes sense. I don't "need" to have a biological child but I feel like I'm being cheated out of some "normal" life expectancies of feeling my child kick me, having my belly grown, having DH feel the kicks, labor, maternity pictures, etc etc etc!
(Sorry for all the caps and !!, I'm just that person) :-)
*BIG hugs*
I have had a m/c and I do not think your post is flammable. It is really hard to understand someone's pain when you have not personally experienced it. Your friend is being rather insensitive. No, you don't know what it is like to have a m/c and it is a very painful thing. But she has no idea how it feels to not be able to get pregnant and that is a very painful thing.
Anyway, people say extraordinarily stupid things when they don't understand something. I have found that talking to an objective third party has helped me sort out the things that I am feeling and to be validated when I couldn't get validation from my friends/family.
You might try the Infertility board. I am sure people there understand what you are going through. {hugs}
I'm going to respond because I completely understand where you are coming from. Your friend is grieving a tangible loss and you are grieving an intangible loss. But it doesn't make yours any less of a loss.
I have sort of experienced both situations. I had 2 very small chemical pregnancies, like a super low beta and then I got my period a week later, so I never really counted myself as someone who was pregnant. And I had to grieve the loss of never knowing what pregnancy felt like, never being able to say my body did something right. We moved onto adoption regardless.
Then, I suddenly got pregnant but had a missed miscarriage and ended up having to do a d&c at 9 weeks. It was awful.
But, and this is flammable to some, for me... the miscarriage was easier to deal with. Because the amount of support I got was overwhelming. People sent me flowers and gift baskets of chocolate. My mom and sister called me constantly to talk. It was just before the holidays and my scotch glass was never unfilled at christmas parties, people were swarming around me with support, shoulders to cry on and love. I also found it easier because it was an acute pain, but I knew that with time it would get easier and easier.
No one knows how to deal with loss when you never had the baby to begin with though, and I can promise you it is just as painful, but you have to do it alone. Also, because there is really no "grief point", no date for people to rally around you, it doesn't follow the typical grief cycle and it's just this awful patter of hope/despair that seems to never end. The support isn't there and it hurts.
I'm so sorry for your loss and I'm so sorry your friend was insensitive. she is hurting right now, but she isn't allowed to make your hurt seem any less.
Thank you for your reply... I think you hit on a point that I've been struggling with when you said that after your miscarriage people were swarming you with support because it was a tangible loss. After my friend had her loss I sent her food, watched her children, went to the church service, listened to her talk through things and when she was ready... took her out in an effort to help her feel better. But because our loss has been strung out over a number of years there hasn't been a time when any of this has been done for us. No one sent us flowers when we got a BFN on a medicated cycle... they said "you'll get'er next time" but of course we never did.
I think you hit the nail on the head and that if my loss were more tangible that it would be easier for people to respond to. You would not believe how much better I feel having read your post. Thank you.
Le sigh, this post was supposed to go to katerena but it didn't work for some reason. Anyway, I wanted to thank you all for the replies. They've all helped me to feel better. It's nice to know that women in the same situation also struggle with these feelings and that I'm not "crazy" after all.
It's so fitting that you wrote this post today...I just went to a friend's babyshower and there were 4 other pregnant women there besides her. Most of them are my friends and I am so extremely happy for them but it's very hard. They even all did a pregnant lady picture together and that was hard because even though our BM is having her baby in December-I still will never be recognized as a "pregnant lady".
Most days not ever being physically pregnant is not hard for me but on other days like today it is all consuming. I got in the car and balled. I called my Mom and my lil sister to vent and get someone to listen. They are both very willing for me to vent but will never "get it." My sister even summed it up perfectly when she said that no one will ever truly understand what I am going through unless they have been through it.
I don't think that people get the sense of loss when it's not something tangible or something they can't see. I get what you mean when you say that you almost would have rather have had a miscarriage for people to be more supportive. I have felt the same way myself. It's not fair for anyone to trivialize your pain just because they don't get it. I'm so sorry for your loss and hope that your friend becomes more supportive. If you ever need someone to talk to about it, you can always PM me.
I have had miscarriages and I was not offended in the least by what you are saying. It's true. The loss is real and it's not made any easier just because you were never pregnant. For me, I was thrilled to be pregnant, even though it didn't last. At least I knew what it felt like. The losses were hard, but knowing it was not going to happen again was hard too.
You have every right to feel how you feel. I'm very sorry that the people in your life are not more understanding. This is an awesome board and I think that you will find a lot of support if you want to stick around.
So sorry you're having a hard time. ((HUGS))
So glad I could help. You are not alone in this, there is a whole army of us right there with you sweetie.
I don't think your feelings are flammable. I know that no one would actually wish for a miscarriage, it sounds like you want validation for your feelings.
I can understand your mourning, the loss of a dream that you were planning and hoping can be every bit as devastating as any other kind of loss.
Don't let anyone tell you to get over it, try talking to someone non-judgmental like a counselor or if you go to church/temple, someone there.
What Katarena said... the loss of ever being pregnant is still a loss. It's intangible but it's still a very personal loss.
I also have never been pregnant, even for a chemical pregnancy. It's absolutely devastating... no IRL gets it, you feel like your body has failed you, maybe even you have failed your husband, and are a failure as a woman. All these things go through your head when you just are simply unable to concieve. I went through all the treatments and medical interventions and I still didn't get pregnant. I had to take the time to mourn the loss of not only having a bio kid, but the loss of the ability of my body to work properly, which I had always taken for granted.
I'm right there with you, down to the fact that I have wished even to have a miscarriage, because at least I could have something to show or share for all these efforts of TTC. At least then IRL, people would understand my pain even if it's just a little bit.
As far as adoption is concerned, I had to go through the mourning before I could consider it. I still mourn occasosionally, I don't think that will ever really go away, but I have accepted the fact that I can't get pregnant.
TTC since May 2006. After 3 failed Clomid cycles, 2 failed Injectibles/IUIs, 2 failed IVFs and 1 failed FET, we moved on to adoption!
Last ditch FET resulted in BFP, and identical twin girls!
IMO not flammable, and I've had losses.
In my experience, I've found that there seems to be this weird sense of competition when it comes to kids, especially when loss is involved. I've heard everything from "at least you were able to TTC, I never even got that chance" to "at least you were able to get pregnant, I haven't even been able to conceive", to attempts on the boards to argue over whether a late loss was worse than an early loss, etc. Fortunately, cooler heads usually prevail when that nonsense starts.
And people grieve these types of loss differently. Some people expect everyone to grieve the same, and that if they think they would have gotten over it, someone else should have too. And that's just not the way life works. It's still a process you have to go through. For many people with IF, they struggle with IF and its associated treatment for years, so 3 years isn't necessarily a long time to be dealing with these emotions.
I know what you're talking about. It's not an unusual feeling. And unfortunately, there are people who are going to make it into a contest. You just need to do what's right for you.
Have you visited the IF board? Women there are in all stages of their IF journey, and some who are nearing a different path or have already moved on still check in.
I don't know if there are any specific boards for what you're talking about, but I'm certainly okay if you want to talk about it on this one.
You're not crazy. You are experiencing a loss. While we were doing IVF, I spoke with a counselor at the clinic. She said that we most definitely experience losses when we're going through infertility. Over the period of 3 IVF cycles, we transferred 7 embryos and I felt loss after each cycle failed. For that day when the embryos were transferred, I felt so much hope that that cycle could finally be IT and the one that worked. When the cycles failed, the pain was incredible. We both had to mourn the loss of a biological child before moving onto adoption. My counselor suggested creating something or doing something in honor of our losses. I'm an artist, so I painted a picture that represented them (I used a tree and birds as symbols, including one bird that was looking ahead toward the future....Not sure if that makes sense.) But she also suggested planting flowers or a tree in their memory/honor. Or writing. Anything to help you deal with the grief and loss.
I'm sorry your friend doesn't get it. It sounds like you have explained your feelings and she's choosing to not listen. Yes, she experienced loss as well, but that doesn't take away from your pain and loss.
Welcome to the board and please feel free to post here. I definitely understand where you're coming from.
I don't believe your post is flammable at all. I, myself, have had 3 early miscarriages and one chemical pregnancy and I don't think I would have been ready to move on if I hadn't gotten to try as much as dh and I did. It was like a sort of closure to help me accept that I needed to move to adoption. We went through so much to get pregnant, and it took IVF to get those 3 pregnancies. And after all of what I put my body through, I was soooooo ready to move on to adoption.
I, personally, didn't find a miscarriage any easier to deal with than not getting pregnant. I agree with the previous poster that said it was easier because of the influx of support afterwards, but I didn't feel anymore support because of the miscarriages. I actually felt people withdraw more, which caused me to have less support. But everyone's situation is different and every person responds to other's pain differently. My family chose not to deal with it.
I don't think you are wrong to mourn the child you never carried. I know I am, in spite of the pregnancies that lasted, I still didn't get to have a biological child, so I am still mourning that. I think anyone who had a desire to have a biological child will also mourn that loss. A loss is a loss. So don't feel alone in that aspect.
I can completely relate to you and I probably could have written the post myself. I am trying to come to terms with not having a biological child. I have always dreamed I would, and now to think i wont, really threw me for a loop. I am doing much better with it then I was, but it still hits me at times. I am trying to come to terms with the fact that no one will understand unless they have been their.
the hardest part for me is having friends with babies or who are pregnant have chats about it and then I feel totally left out I guess. One case in point...a coworker of mine is pregnant, she had questions about breastfeeding and pumping at work, so she went to another coworker to talk. I wasnt in on the convo, but got the recap when chatting witht hem. They basically feel that no one knows that it is like (well of course i dont) but they think that those who havent dont get it or sympathize with their needs etc. I think I am a caring person and DO sympathize. It kind of hurt for them to say that, esp to me...when they both know their IF struggles.
It is just little things like that, that really get to me. You ARE grieving. we are grieving the fact that life sure isnt going where we thought it would and it might never. That is a hard thing to come to terms with!!!!!
I don't think your post is flamable at all. I mourn the bio children that we will never have. DH & I have been TTC for almost 5 years. We have been moving closer and closer to adoption the more we have gone through. After our latest IVF was canceled due to poor response, we decided it was time. That doesn't mean that I don't mourn the fact that I will never look into my child's eyes and see my mom's chin, or my husband's eyes. Especially seeing my nieces and nephews have the family resemblance. It's not an easy thing to let go of, but I finally decided I can't control the fact that I'm unable to conceive. What I can control is the fact that I am going to be a mother. And, I'm going to love my children, no matter how they came to me.
I'm sorry you are surrounded by some people making insensitive comments. I hope that you are able to make peace with your decision, no matter what.
PM me if you need to talk. I'm still recovering from the idea of not being able to conceive, even though we are moving forward with foster-adopt.
This may sound silly, but I just wanted to say Thank You for this post. Over the last few weeks . . . . maybe months I have been having similar feelings. I had a mc over the summer after a long road of ttc. My husband and I have decided that its time to adopt, and since that decision I have been struggling with these feelings of loss that no one seems to understand. I have tried to talk to a few people in my life and they just placate me by saying, "it's gonna happen for you just give it time." Its just hard when you feel so alone in your pain and you don't really have anyone in your life that really understands what it is you are going through.
I found nothing in your post to be offensive. I am so sorry for what you are going through and I want you to know that while you may not have any close friends and family around you that understand where you are coming from, there are many of us on this board that do.
Not flammable at all. It is SO hard -- all of it. And though I've learned to trust in God's plan and I pray to want what HE wants for us, it's still hard and I'll never understand it. I just now have a peace that I am OK with not understanding it.
I can see now that everything was always leading us to THIS and while I am not GLAD that I am infertile (never ever will I be glad), I ... appreciate it. I can respect it.
Yes.
you have hit the nail on the head!!!!. most people dont understand or treat ttcing and not getting PG as a loss. i'm so very sorry. i have struggled with this for quite some time now and always will remember the lack of support.I i have even discussed this with my DH and have mentioned to him how we will be buried in gifts if a baby arrives, but now noone shows tangibly acts of recognition of our loss. i have been angry and disappointed that my struggles never warranted at least a card. i simply just treat it as ignorance and also as if you haven't experienced a journey, you don't know what it's about. sadly, people don't treat miscarriages as losses, either. i remember a co-worker of mine and her most recent miscarriage (as my co-worker) recd zero cards. it just doesn't receive the recognition of loss that it should and sadly the entire IF process doesnt receive much reaction of loss from the outsiders:(
im sorry your friend is being insensitive and simply uneducated. i encourage you to be open about your journey and explain to her what a loss it's been for you. she may be enlightened. i know my sisters have been enlightened when i use the word "loss."
((HUGS))
Hello everyone, thank you for the wonderful replies... yesterday was a very hard day for me, and your support was what got me through. I usually just lurk on these boards and even though I am not a regular you ladies came through with exactly what I needed, when I needed it.
It is always a relief to learn that there are women out there who are having the same "horrible" thoughts and feelings that I'm having during this process... that infact, we are not "crazy" but reacting to terrible circumstances in normal ways. Thank God for this board, and you ladies. I don't know how women survived IF before the internet.
I've arrived at this post a bit late, but just wanted to confirm everything that has already been said. This is a horrible pain that nobody who has not been through this (and this includes my husband, although he tries) fully understands. I was lucky that my friends and family tried, though, and have been very supportive. Nobody should ever imply that this is not a real loss, it most certainly is and, like someone else said, shame on anyone who implies otherwise.
I am so sorry for your loss and your pain. I know for me, this time of year is particularly difficult. Even though I have known for a few years now that I will not be able to get pregnant, it still hurts and the pain grows during the holidays. Hang in there!
I know exactly what you mean. I did the same thing, comparing every child that was the age our child would have been had we conceived to the one I should have had. It wasn't until my son came along that I stopped doing it. But even now I think about how many kids I would have had it all worked out 5 years ago.
I think you have every right to grieve a loss, and your friends are jerks IMO. I have friends and family who have had several losses (between plenty of healthy kids) and they feel guilty even being sad about it around me! Which of course is ridiculous, they should absolutely feel sad, but they feel like compared the the countless losses we've had they shouldn't feel sad. THAT is a true friend. Of course I tell them to feel sad, and I validate their losses, but the fact that they even feel that way means they totally get what we go through time and time again.
I am SO SO SO Sorry about your friends. I COMPLETELY COMPLETELY know what you are talking about, and you have EVERY right to grieve.
I don't think what you said is bad at all. It is completely valid to feel the way you are.
IF is so misunderstood. No one truly understands unless they are the female dealing with it... (my dh doesn't hurt the way I do) Even if somehow, after 3 years, I am able to get pregnant and give birth, I will still live knowing the pain of IF for the rest of my life. Not something I would wish on anyone.
Changing gears and moving to adoption has been both very helpful and very hard on me in dealing with IF.
I think it's totally normal to feel a sense of loss- and it's something that unless you have gone through it- you cannot understand. Infertiltiy for me was very isolating- because none of my friends had dealt with it. I do think that it would be helpful for you to talk to someone- because it sounds like you need to work through these feelings, and do not feel so alone.