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susanmosley
member
differing parenting philosophies at playdates
susanmosley
member
I have mentioned on here before (or discussed in great length) my social ineptness. So, maybe this is just a result of that.
How do you feel/deal in this situation?
Disclaimer: this isn't a judgment on parenting styles, I really don't care how people parent their children.
At a play date the other day, DD (almost 2) was playing with a t 3 yo boy. DD was fascinated by his shenanigans and saying "more more" for everything he would do - silly jumps, turning in circles, etc. So he kept doing more. And the excitement build and the boy "spit" in DD's face. DD laughed, the boy wasn't being mean, just over excited and trying to raise the bar for DD's praise and encouragement. In response, the mom abruptly ended their time at the get together, disciplined her son, tried to make him apologize, which he wasn't able to do - too upset (tears, snot, the whole 9 yards). She apologized to me repeatedly. The next day, she made the boy apologize.
Here is my ordeal(s) - I wasn't upset, DD wasn't upset and I don't think the boy meant to spit. I have no issue with the way the mother chose to address the situation. In fact, I respect how concerned and not okay she was with her kid spitting. But it makes me so uncomfortable b/c I don't think the event was THAT big of a deal. Nor do I think I would have DD apologize the next day if the roles were reversed - after all DD egged him on and he wasn't being malicious and the are toddlers! So, now I am left worrying what other moms will think of me if DD ever did something like that and I am more nonchalant about it. And then I get stressed thinking about how many hundreds of time this type of situation will arise.
Another quick example. A same age neighbor boy was playing with DD in our front yard. The boy did something, mom corrected him, he did it again, mom dramatically threatened spanking him. DD stood wide eyed, taken back by the sudden change in vibe and we are stuck standing there as the mom and 1 y/o exchange yells and swipes.
So, do you all hang out with people with similar techniques to child rearing or are you able to just not really care what other people do and go on about your business? Does anyone else understand how I feel and feel the same way?
This discussion has been closed.
Re: differing parenting philosophies at playdates
Spitting in someone's face, no matter how "playful" is just not right. You wouldn't want your DD to ever think that was ok to do to someone. I think the other parent handled it really well actually.
I typically hang out with people that have the same parenting philosophies. I can't imagine hanging out with people very often if they don't believe in raising their kids the same way I do.
Ditto previous poster- i am sure she was just humiliated by the scene- and i am SURE that she isn't judging your non chalance at all- i am sure she didn't even give it a thought because she was overly concerned about how her son acted.
I would have been the same way as you- no biggie- he didn't mean it- etc. I guess I would have just said if i was the mom I would have told my DD to say- 'opps, sorry- I didn't mean to do that' or something along those lines but not make a super big deal out of it.
For the most part I guess I hang around a lot of people that (like you) seem pretty laid back about letting kids be kids- with in reason of course. Not much gets me rattled or worked up. I dont think i have ever really been in a situation like that were I felt uncomfortable about something that happened in my presence regarding different parenting styles or whatnot ~ but i can totally empathize with how you feel-
Ditto this. I would be horrified if my son spit in someone's face, no matter what his intent was. I think the other mom was totally appropriate with her response.
When I first started making "mom friends," I met a group who had a very different parenting philosophy than I had and I really struggled with dealing with them. (These moms were basically "non-discipliners" under any circumstance.) I didn't want my son to think the behavior these children portrayed was acceptable so eventually, I just stopped hanging around that certain group and found friends who had a similar approach to parenting as me. It made it a heck of a lot easier at playdates when I knew the other moms wouldn't look at me like I was a horrible monster for using the word no and I knew I could trust my friends to appropriately discipline my son if I left the room, etc.
Noel - August 2010
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I completely agree with you both that spitting in a face is really not good. I think something should have been said to the boy, or whatever. And for the record, it wasn't a hawk/spit type of deal - it was a raspberries/motor boat deal and her face was close. But that really isn't my issue.
But Harriet, what you bring up IS my issue. You think that mom's response was a good one. I think it was a little over the top - 24+ hours of this being an issue is a little much for me. Thus the entire situation made me uncomfortable because I just felt horrible on day two knowing that the little boy had to leave his home just to set out and give apologies. I am certain he knew from the moment it happened that it wasn't good. And he was embarrassed....as was I...and DD was clueless. THIS is my inquiry. Do you find yourself feeling uncomfortable when stuck in the crossfire of other parenting ways? I feel like there have been multiple times recently when DD and I are left standing (and she is intently staring out of curiosity) amongst a disciplining moment that is nothing like DD has ever witnessed....you don't want to smile b/c you don't want the child to see that you are fine when the mom is upset, you don't want to appear upset because you are not and don't think the punishment fits the crime, and honestly, you don't want to be there anymore b/c it isn't really about you but there is no way to escape. Anyone feel me on this?
Arg, I don't think I am stating this well.
I think you reacted fine with the spitting thing. It's good to be able to recognize when a kid means to do something, and when it just kinda happens.
I have been sort of struggling with this too. I'm spending a lot of time with another mother (a friend) and her LO who is a bit older than mine. I am learning that we have wildly differing parenting styles. I worry already that she's judging my parenting (based on comments she's made).
OMG - I didn't notice that there was a "day 2" to the apologizing. Yes, that's over the top, but I'm sure she wanted to really teach him a lesson. I don't go that far! LOL!
I can tell you that I'm very lax when it comes to a lot of things in terms of parenting and playdates. I'm not over the top with punishments - I'm with the punishment fitting the crime.
I honestly don't care what other people do in terms of punishment. And I do hang out with some people that are over the top in terms of how they handle each situation, but our parenting philosophy is similar. So, I can tolerate the way that they handle it even though it's not the way I do it.
It doesn't bother me. I can see how you felt awkward, but I think I would have said to the mom that there was no harm done and that you forgot about it completely and it wasn't necessary for the boy to apologize but thank you so much for coming back and really trying to reinforce that spitting was bad to the boy.
UGH - parenting is very hard sometimes........
One of my mommy friends and I were discussing something similar the other day. One of our friends is extremely lax in what behaviors she chooses to react to. Her son is allowed to climb on whatever (couches, ledges, book shelves, or anything else.) My friend became concerned when her son started doing the same behaviors at her house because the other little boy was. She chose to talk to her own son about the behavior, thinking the mom of the other little boy might realize that maybe he shouldn't do this behavior either. No response. She finally had to step in when the little boy started to do something she thought was dangerous.
We pretty much came to the conclusion that as long as the behavior wasn't unsafe, we'd let the other parent displine however they choose.
well, hell. I was thinking that that was probably the answer - it's just part of the job.
Wow, I wish we could be friends - I would have wanted to react the way you did but I would have acted the way the other mom did to the spitting because I have really overzealous kids and so many people totally overreact to some of the things they do. so I tend to overcompensate and try to "make them conform" so we still get included in play dates. DH & I are more casual about physical stuff, and harder on them about manners - and it causes some difficulties with some other families.
for example: early last spring (2009) my neighbor, with whom I had started to develop a good friendship (and several of our kids are similar ages so they can be friends), was checking her mail - the neighborhood gang-box is in my front yard. She was about 6-7 mo pregnant with #3, and my then 3yo - who is big for his age - was so excited to see her that he went running outside and ran into her to hug her. Unfortunately, he ran and hugged a bit too hard and knocked her off balance and she sort of fell/sat hard. I felt horrible, he felt horrible, she was worried. Pretty much that was the end of our family friendship. She stopped letting her boys come to our house, stopped inviting my kids to her house, and only wants to spend time with me if we can "get out alone" for coffee or something.
That being said, when I'm with other people, I don't really care what THEIR parenting methods are or what their children's behavior is as long as it isn't physically damaging to my kids and as long as they are not overtly abusive or neglectful with theirs. I talk to my kids a lot about family cultures and how they differ from home to home, even within extended families (like my mom, ILs, or cousins homes).
Parenting around other families has been one of my more difficult balancing acts as a parent. I always want to be respectful of them, while not selling ourselves out - I find it hard to do.
THAT. I guess this is exactly how I am feeling. We're just fine when it is just our family, but when other families get in the mix, I just feel like I want to LEAVE and get back to our simple, happy, calm, quiet ways. It is nothing against them, it is me trying to figure out how to stay comfortable with our ways and decisions amongst others that vary greatly. And I guess the other part is that DD is easy, reserved, an observer, etc. So, I am not put in the reverse situations. DD hasn't yet been the "aggressor" or the one causing the problems. In time, I know.
I think this sounds about right.
Good response.
How funny. My kids, especially my boys, are the polar opposite of calm, quiet & observing. They are sort of very sweet "Dennis the Menace" types in skin. My 4yo hasn't met an object over 5ft tall not worthy of climbing. I was an only of a single mom, so it has taken me several kids to get accustomed to the noise and activity - but now that I am, it's hard when others have a hard time with us. And, even though my girls are much calmer, they have learned to roll with it and can TOTALLY hold their own with the boys - so they tend to jump right in with other kids too.
I really respect the poster who said that she'll take her child and step away from another parent who is disciplining - thereby giving that family their privacy to handle a situation in a way that works for them.
Ditto.
When I first became a mom, I was fairly close minded in how the parenting world works. I kind of wanted other moms to share similar parenting philosophies that I do. In the end, I think that lead to a lot of conflicts because everyone thinks their way is the right way and it is...for THEIR family, not mine. It took me a long while to realize that and be more tolerant of other people's parenting styles. That's not to say that I still don't have my own thoughts on how *I* would've handled something in any given situation, but it's a lot easier for me to say to myself, "that mom is the best mom for her child and she's doing it the way she knows is best for her kid. I am not that kid's mom, and I do not know what is the best way to handle or communicate with them" and leave it be. Of course there are still the occasional parent that I really really do clash with and I'm ok with not being friends with them. It's cool. I don't HAVE to be friends with everyone nor do I have to even appreciate everyone. It's fine, but you can bet your arse that I will step up and say something if another parent tries to parent my child the way they do their kid, and I don't agree with their parenting style. Now don't get me wrong...I definitely appreciate it if someone were to stop my child from doing something they shouldn't be especially if it endangers themselves of others, but they are not permitted to say, spank my children just because THEY feel something my kids did warranted a spank.
In your specific situations though, personally, I think the moms were right to take spitting so seriously. It is, imho something that should be taken seriously and taught that that is not appropriate to do in any situation regardless of intention. I agree w/Harriet, and I would've handled it the same way as the moms did....BUT I wouldn't have dragged it on for 2 days. If I was in your shoes, I probably would've just dismissed it and said something to the nature of, "don't worry about it, it's water under the bridge," and moved on. Do you have to agree w/the other mom? Certainly not. If a mom did something that I didn't agree with, I think I've been a mom long enough and seen enough varieties of parenting to just not say anything...unless of course, if the mom was blatantly abusive. Every parent has their own style. There is no such thing as one size fits all parenting, but there is such a thing as tolerance and accepting that people are different. They know their child better than you know them. They know what gets through to them.
So I guess to answer your question, no I don't only hang around with people who parent like I do, but there are extremes on both sides that tends to flow into how *I* parent my kids and those people I do not hang out with because they try to force their methods and style onto me and my kids and homey don't play that. I don't care how they parent their children, just don't try to do it to my kids. I do understand how you feel because I used to feel that way too, but I've been in the game long enough now that I've built up a lot more tolerance than I used to have.
Thanks for the reply.
I want to reiterate that I am not asking about opinions on how this mom handled the situation. I made the mistake of describing the incident in depth. I also have to restate that I think this mom and her kids are lovely. I have absolutely no issues with what she did (beside knowing that I would have done things differently). I don't really care how they address things. Nor do I know background info - maybe this boy has a spitting history. I don't know and I know I don't know.
My question is, do you other moms feel uncomfortable when caught in a situation with another mom/kid that is not a situation you would be in typically? It makes me extremely uncomfortable. I am not a time out-er or a spanker, so the drama (harsh movements, change in tone, tantruming kids, yelling parents) is very foreign to me and DD and makes me uncomfortable. I know I keep saying the same thing. I don't really care if someone else does time out, spanking, whatever, but I don't like being part of it. But I am answering my own question, realizing that this is going to be an on going issue and I need to figure out how to deal and not let it make me so uncomfortable. And on the flip side, not worry if other parents think my parenting/disciplining techniques are not good enough or what they would do.
thanks for the discussion
You have to remember that your DD isn't even 2 yet. So, you don't need to discipline her like you would older kids. You've lucked out if your DD hasn't had a tantrum yet. It will happen, even with very well behaved kids. So, if you're so uncomfortable with how other people handle their kids, are you going to be embarassed that she throws a tantrum?
I really do think you need to find a way to not be so uncomfortable, otherwise your playdates for your DD are going to be few and far between.
What types of discipline techniques do you use? If you're not a time-outer and not a spanking (I don't spank either but do use time out) mom, what do you do?
Does it make me uncomfortable? Sure. I think it's always an awkward situation to be caught in when a mom is disciplining their child, but I'd rather that than for her to be lackadaisical about it and to have her child keep repeating the inappropriate behavior...especially at my child. I think all of us have children that have been "victims" to inappropriate behavior at some point be it biting, spitting, yanking a toy out of their hands, etc. Like I said, it's all about tolerance for me. People are different. I've gotten more accepting of it and it bothers me less now than it used to. I don't like to be caught in the middle of it either and like I said, in your shoes, I would've just said it's water under the bridge and move on. (Sorry if you missed that part, I edited and added it after I made the original post.) I don't want to be caught in the middle of it any more and I refuse to. Like I said, as long as the other people aren't pushing their beliefs and philosophies on me and my children, I really don't care. If it really becomes bothersome, I would just remove myself from the situation and get up and leave if I have to. If that doesn't work and it bothers you that much, then explain to the mom that it's really not an issue anymore, it's forgiven and forgotten. Make it clear that any issue she may have with it is no longer YOUR problem because you are done with it.
You can't control other people but you can control how other people affect you.
In general, I think you have to let stuff like that go if you want to be friends with people. I probably yell too much, and I am not a hoverer, so I tend to let the kids do their thing until they get to close to the edge so to speak. I am friends with people who hover and never yell at their kids. I don't judge them. We all have our thing. I sometimes think some are to soft, some are too hard on their kids, but we are all pretty good parents and we are all doing it the best we know how.
The only people who bother me are people who try to make other parents feel like their way is inadequate and people who don't recognize their own failings or those of their children (think they are just so fantastic in other words).
My question is, do you other moms feel uncomfortable when caught in a situation with another mom/kid that is not a situation you would be in typically?
Yes, I do feel uncomfortable when I am caught in a situation like that. For example, I took my DD to the mall a few days ago (14 months old). She began playing nicely with a girl about 2.5 years old. The little girl was really excited to be playing with my daughter-- everything was great until she accidentally bumped my DD with a book (the corner hit near her eye) and my DD started crying (because it genuinely hurt/surprised her). I saw what happened, and the other child's mom did not. I picked up my DD to comfort her told the little girl, "It's okay, I understand that you didn't mean to hurt her & my DD will be ready to play with you in a few moments once she catches her breathe. It just surprised her." The other mom turns around and holds her 2.5 yr old's shoulders (firmly) and used a loud/angry voice "Did you hurt that little baby? What did you do? You better apologize RIGHT now!!" (all this without pause to listen to her child). By this point, my DD has stopped crying and was ready to play with the girl. She was watching the mom interact with the girl. The girl started crying (feeling shamed, and obviously not understood or listened to). She could hardly gasp for air between cries, and then the mom said, "well if you aren't going to apologize we will leave and you WILL get a spank the minute we get home". She continued wailing, now angry with her mom (again, this is what happens when you don't listen to your child). It's turning into quite a scene-- over basically nothing. Meanwhile, my DD is just in shock & awe watching this the mom's behavior & the girl crying. I'm sure the mom had good intentions, but it's very different than how I would have handled things...u know?
I just remind myself that my DD will be exposed to all kinds of people and ultimately it's up to me (and DH) to model behavior we believe is appropriate.
I didn't read the responses, so forgive me if this was mentioned. But reading your post, the first thing that came to mind is that this spitting may be an ongoing thing with him that she's trying to work on. You weren't bothered by it and it may have been innocent enough, but if he has a history of doing it to other kids/people, I can see why she would have reacted the way that she did.
I do not let Ben get away with these types of behaviors (hitting, pushing, spitting, etc.). I make him stop what he is doing, apologize and tell him that if he repeats the behavior, we're leaving. Most of the time, that's enough to get him to stop. If he doesn't, we leave. He is a stubborn little guy and I have to be consistent with him or he'll never learn that there are behaviors that are acceptable those that are not...and consequences that go along with them.
Most of the moms that I hang out with are in my moms groups and our playgroup and have a similar parenting style to me. Maybe not exact, but close enough that there's rarely been an issue.
Out in public places I have been known on many an occasion to correct other people's children who hit/push/kick/whatever Ben. I don't care if the mom has a problem with it or not. I don't let him do these things to other children and I sure as hell am not going to let them do it to him. If the mom doesn't notice or is far away, I correct the child. If it happens more than once, I go say something to her that her child has done ((insert behavior)) to Ben x number of times now and I would appreciate it if she would handle it.
Sparky, I LOL at your response because I can SO imagine being in that situation. I feel like I have a hundred times in the last few weeks. Thanks for relating!!! Like I mentioned earlier, I messed up by describing the spitting incident as people were commenting more on the discipline technique (and their opinions) than my feelings (LOL). I don't care how the parents handle it, just get me out of it!! I hate standing there staring a kid in tears waiting for them to apologize. It stresses me out. And I don't want to undermine the mom by saying, "it's ok" or "don't worry about it." I repeatedly feel like I am standing with my kid in the middle of a situation that I want nothing to do with. It is amusing to an extent. And next time it happens, after this thread, I will possibly laugh out loud and escape.
seans_grl - yeah, I thought about that perhaps he had a spitting history. I know I don't know the background. But as l said, that is neither here nor there, I just hate being a part of it. HA! But I have learned 'tis life. This is going to happen a million more times.
I guess it's "semantics" with the use of the word "timeout"........if you're removing your child from the situation and putting them somewhere, then that's what it is.
I don't do hugs and apologies after time out. Most times though, my kids will ask for a hug and I will hug them. Sometimes they say I'm sorry and it's genuine. Sometimes they don't and I'm fine with it.
The book 123 Magic is great with this technique (no apologies, etc. after timeout).
I also never say never! LOL! I have 3 kids, and sometimes I do bark "timeout" to them. I try really hard to keep my cool, but it's way too hard!
GL to you! I'm sure you'll figure out a way to not feel so uncomfortable in these situations.
This. I have had my son apologize the next day for his actions on a prior day. I want to him respect others, whether he's playing or excited, that doesn't matter. And spitting is not acceptable behavior in my house.
I want to state one final time that my "issue" is not what the mom did, the disciplinary technique, or the family. I don't care what they do. They are lovely people and we will hang out again.
My question is, does anyone feel extremely uncomfortable (as in want to run and hide under the nearest rock) when stuck in the middle of a parenting moment that is not in line with yours? I hate it. I hate being trapped in the middle of other people's business. I guess that is all I am saying. Is it just me or is being in the middle of other people's disciplinary techniques stressful and uncomfortable?
And I suppose the second part of the question, is if yes to the above questions, do you just not hang out with people who approach things so differently, or do you just learn to not let it bother you?
But really, I just want to drop this topic that I started!
Mama2many, I can relate to you because I have 2 very active and large for their age little boys. Several times in the past (ages 2 & 3) I have been in a situation where my older son hurt another child (accidentally or on purpose) at a playdate and have severely disciplined him (time out, apology, stern rebuke) and have found out later that even though the mom said "Oh it's no big deal, don't worry about it," they then talked about it behind my back and that everything wasn't ok. I have found that I need friends that are less judgmental and more laid back if I don't want to have all of that stress.
So I look at the mom in the first post as trying to overcompensate because it's better to overcompensate than to undercompensate and lose a friend. Esp. since he is a boy and she's a girl -- I am mortified if my son is aggressive to girls since I never want him to hit a girl, you know?
Rather than parents who share my parenting style - I really appreciate parents who have kids like mine and who aren't entirely shy about discipline. We have friends from church who have kids more active than ours are (which is pretty hard to find). The mother said that she wants to have T shirts made for when she goes out in public that say (in her cute southern accent) "I am SOOOO sorry". I just cracked up!
It is very hard for those with basically quiet kids who follow their parents like little ducks to "get" my kids without thinking that we let them behave like maniacs. We don't. But that is why God gave us our kids, and other people theirs. I'm also starting to get that kids are kids, and they occasionally are mean/careless with each other - just like adults can be.
Ultimately, 99% of us do our best and end up with basically decent adults at the end. When I do come across parents whose parenting style is difficult for me to be around, I try to suck it up if I can, or steer clear of them - but that's pretty rare.