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MrsGo4Hockeychick
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Hold the phone! Really?
MrsGo4Hockeychick
member
People actually BELIEVE that article posted below? Seriously?
Has anyone here actually READ the health care bill? I'm guessing not.
Because the "implantables" that article talks about in reality are things like pacemakers and other LIFE SAVING AND LIFE SUSTAINING devices. The "FDA definition" given in the article is also not the actual definition.
They're wanting to create a registry of implanted medical devices. Not wanting to micro-chip society. Talk about irresponsible journalism.
And FWIW, most hospitals that do implant medical devices already keep a registry. It helps us keep track of people for updates and in case of any recalls. This would be a national database instead of a care provider specific one.
And if anyone cares to actually read it for themselves, the bill can be found here: https://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/aahca.pdf
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Re: Hold the phone! Really?
11 months
11 months
debate? yes. Post an article as though it is actually going to happen? No.
I think it should be posted. It makes people realize something they would or would not. Likely or not.
I totally thing their are people in office who would push for something like this. Maybe not right now, but I don't think it has never been mentioned before in the government.
11 months
I think it should be posted. It makes people realize something they would or would not. Likely or not.
I totally thing their are people in office who would push for something like this. Maybe not right now, but I don't think it has never been mentioned before in the government.
11 months
It was not posted as a "there are rumors this kind of thing might happen".
It was posted as "this is in the bill, and if it passes we're all going to be microchipped!!!"
One of these things is not like the others....
This article is the epitome of scare tactic, sensationalized, irresponsible and shoddy journalism. THAT'S what I have a problem with.
For or against ObamaCare, journalism like this does no one any good.
I believe it does, it keeps people on their toes. Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. Who is to say he doesn't believe it? Or it shouldn't be believed?
11 months
This.
really? Believe what you want.
But when a "news outlet" (and I use that term very loosely in this case) presents "facts" that aren't so much facts as they are deliberate falsehoods, I take issue with that. Whether it be about ObamaCare, the war in Iraq or any other issue that affects us today.
I agree Go4.
Regardless of political beliefs, I do not want to be lied to about this stuff, and it really angers me.
"Those who control the information control the people." --George Orwell, 1984
If we don't insist on responsible journalism, when do we know what we're being told is truth? And journalists can be (and have--google NYT writer and the word 'plagiarism') fired, sued, and penalized for not reporting accurate info.
I haven't read the article yet, but there is a reason to get up-in-arms about implantables and registries: if you allow the gov't permission to do something like that (even for useful reasons) it's tougher to STOP it from happening when it becomes controlling and communistic.
<a href="http://s1103.photobucket.com/albums/g471/HealthfulMama/?action=view
I don't believe it is "lying." It could be what he believes or how he interprets it.
My point is, people should be cautious in general. Chips have been brought up in the past. Wether or not it is in this present bill is besides the point. It could always become part of a bill.
I think people should always be careful how much involvement they allow their government into their everyday lives. The more a government (or anyone or anything) is allowed into your life, the more they think they deserve to control. So, people, in general should always be aware of what is going on and what even some people consider crazies think is possible, it is how things balance out.
I also truly believe, like I said before. That it is no coincidence that all of a sudden cancer screening requirements are being downgraded.
11 months
well said the language part of my brain is still sleeping ;o)
11 months
11 months
Well, I am gullible. Martket and scare tactics work on me. I am probably a great one for hypnotism, although I have never tried. I generally react and then go read about it after.
I posted something I saw that upset me. I didn't say it was true, I did not push my beliefs on anyone, or even say what I thought of the health-care issue in general. I just posted it because I felt like it and NO WAY do I want microchipping. It is bad enough that we do this to our dogs. Sure, if it would only be used for good things, like to return your pets or help identify dementia patients, etc, but I think it could easily start being used in bad ways.
I don't have a problem with tracking medical devices that are necessary for life, like pacemakers and the like. It would be very important to know if something like that were to have a problem. I just think it is an invasion of privacy to do chipping and I don't need someone to track me.
i absolutely agree with go4! that crappy website was totally misrepresenting the facts and was relying on people to read it, believe it, and look no further for the truth (since the truth is contained in a very long, jargon-filled document, which, it seems this crappy article took way out of context). totally irresponsible journalism and definitely propaganda.
luvlie - yes, i agree, people should debate the what ifs, but that's not what the intent of this article was. this article was clearly preying on the uniformed, the skeptical, and the fearful.
" this article was clearly preying on the uniformed, the skeptical, and the fearful."
....in other words, me? I would probably agree with that.
ALSO:
i think a lot of you are missing the real issue here. the issue is not "are implantables right or wrong?" FWIW i happen to think the vast majority of americans would disagree with mandatory impantables, i being one of them!.
the issue is: should facts be misrepresented and political literature be taken out of context and presented to a (generally) unsuspecting and uninformed and fearful public for the benefit of one journalist's (or news outfit's) political agenda? no, it shouldn't.
but it IS lying. It's the one of the most perfect examples of lying, by definition.
The author directly and purposefully stated that there was wording in the bill calling for microchipping of all citizens using ObamaCare. There is nothing that even comes close to stating that in the actual bill.
What is it if it's not lying?
And I said it before, and I'll say it again. Discussing and believing in conspiracy theories is a whole different ballgame than presenting those theories as absolute truths as this article did.
we will have to agree to disagree on this one. I've seen these registries save lives, and see nothing wrong with keeping track of who has a medtronic pacemaker with this batch #.
And I absolutely do NOT equate keeping a registry of implantable medical devices with microchipping society, and do not see one as a slippery slope to the other.
THANK YOU!
I in no way, shape or form am agreeing people should be microchipped. Never have, never will.
I agree with you.
Debating a hypothetical is one thing. Presenting it as facts that are actually in the health care bill is lying.
11 months
luvlie, you're going to have to back up your assertions with reputable facts.
The only biometric tracking devices currently in the news is a call to change IDs to carry information such as fingerprints. As of yet, there are no bills or otherwise in the government pushing for microchips.
Most of the push for microchips for children has been through child welfare groups not affiliated with the government.
I work for a company who assists HHS with all their Health Information Technology Policy and Standards decisions. FYI, all the decisions being made regarding HIT (which is EHRs/EMRs and anything that would share that info, being a tool in your doctor's office or pharmacy to a potential microchip) is completely transparent to the public via the Federal Advisory Committee Act (FACA). There are so many conspiracy theorists and anti "ObamaCare" folks out there, many in very high positions of power, that they have been forced to keep everything, even administrative meetings where they discuss which hotel to stay at for a meeting - public.
Funny how they have these meetings and we are lucky to have a dozen members of the public attend virtually, hardly any attend in person. I have to attend all of them and have learned a LOT. I encourage those who are interested or worried to do your homework because there is a crapload of information out there.
The biggest thing I learned that anything, be it just an electronic version of a prescription or a microship storing information and your GPS tracking and a way to make you spontaneously combust if you become a Communist needs to be a tool that can be used on everyone in the US - those in rural Alaska, those who live in cities where no one speaks English, those on reservations, those with only dial-up Internet, etc.
Because there are Communists who need to be destroyed in all parts of America, not just the wired suburban part of it. So we have time before we are all controlled.
VA and I believe Missouri. Can be found in the washington post, among other place.
eta: My only reason mentioning it is to say that talk of microchips is out there.
11 months
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
--Benjamin Franklin, 1775
Providers definately keep serial numbers for implantables, in fact most insurance companies refuse to pay for them without that number being submitted to them.
Which is why when the Patriot Act went into effect I cried for our country, and every single time it's been renewed.
Indeed.
Debate, yes, post an article full of incorrect information, no. People need accurate information to make knowledgeable conclusions one way or the other.
agreed.