I can't wrap my mind around this

star173 · May 2009

I have faith in God- a lot of faith. I understand many different points of view as well...but this I just don't get. I mean, why eat if you can just believe enough that you'll be full....why do you look both ways before crossing the street- does that mean you don't trust God? How could you do this to your child?!? And what will the mom think if her son dies- will she care? Will she feel sorry? Ugh.

carolinag · May 2009

dh and discussed this last night. given the sucess rate of the chemo i would be viewing that as a gift from god. it is so sad. i hope they find them soon.

userdeleted · May 2009

That is very very sad. I don't understand how people get to a place like that. I mean seriously, what is the train of thought that leads them to such a whacked out conclusion.

Janimal · May 2009

This is heartbreaking.

This hits close to home for me. My 13yr old nephew has been going through chemo and radiation for a brain tumor, and the family is going through hell. It's horrible, but it's his chance for survival.

Amrice78 · May 2009

Stuff like this frustrates me. I have a great deal of faith as well, I pray for healing all the time, but I also believe God gave us brains and made medicine/doctors available for a reason. I think it's self-righteous and arrogant to think that God will heal you or your child without you accepting His earthly help (medicine and doctors).

breezey2323 · May 2009

I just saw something somewhat like this on Law & Order SVU.

I'm sure she will care, she's just brainwashed. I don't understand religions that say you cannot have medical treatment (blood transfusions, ect). God wouldn't have made these treatments available if he didn't want us to utilize them. That's my feeling anyways. And even if i truely believed that, God would just have to forgive me - this is my child's life we're talking about.

Mrs.Provost · May 2009

Eek. I think it's a very scary scary slope to be sliding down to let any governing bodies FORCE medical treatment on someone who is unwilling.

This brings so many things into play - religious freedom, freedom to choose one's own medical treatment, parents' rights to choose, and even when does a child get to decide for themselves.

I really feel a bit sick thinking about courts being able to force someone to go against their moral and religious beliefs. We live in a country with the freedom to choose one's own religion - and that right HAS to be upheld, even when we may not personally agree with the choice the person is making.

Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

People have rights, even when it makes us uncomfortable.

Amrice78 · May 2009

Mrs.Provost:

Eek. I think it's a very scary scary slope to be sliding down to let any governing bodies FORCE medical treatment on someone who is unwilling.

This brings so many things into play - religious freedom, freedom to choose one's own medical treatment, parents' rights to choose, and even when does a child get to decide for themselves.

I really feel a bit sick thinking about courts being able to force someone to go against their moral and religious beliefs. We live in a country with the freedom to choose one's own religion - and that right HAS to be upheld, even when we may not personally agree with the choice the person is making.

Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

People have rights, even when it makes us uncomfortable.

Oh I agree with you 100% Very sipperly slope when the government starts forcing people to go against their religious beliefs, but it doesn't stop me from being sick over the decision the parents are making.

userdeleted · May 2009

breezey2323:
I don't understand religions that say you cannot have medical treatment (blood transfusions, ect). God wouldn't have made these treatments available if he didn't want us to utilize them.

I think the argument against this would be something along the lines of "Well do you think God wanted us to use guns or drugs!? Not everything that's here is good!"

And to a point this is true. Not everything that is available to us is good for our minds/bodies/souls. The problem is that some people, instead of sitting down and trying to think of a logical way to separate the good from the bad decide to instead just dismiss everything as the work of Satan. Better safe than sorry, right?

happilyhis · May 2009

Agree with Mrs.Provost.

brandonsfuturewife07 · May 2009

i saw that on the today show this morning. i guess they haven't been seen since before they missed a court appearance? the dad doesn't even know where they are (he says).

i can't believe it. i really can't. it is so disgusting. i didn't know the boy couldn't read though. i hope they find her and take her 6 other kids away. she has no right to be raising kids in that kind of environment.

Momma_S · May 2009

Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

Keep in mind that he has a learning disability and cannot read. I don't know what his disability is, but it is possible that he is not able to comprehend the situation. He didn't even believe he was sick.

With that said, I'm torn on this issue. I don't think the courts should be able to force them to take treatment. I also don't think the mother should be able to deny treatment that would most likely save his life.

userdeleted · May 2009

Momma_S:
Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

Keep in mind that he has a learning disability and cannot read. I don't know what his disability is, but it is possible that he is not able to comprehend the situation. He didn't even believe he was sick.

With that said, I'm torn on this issue. I don't think the courts should be able to force them to take treatment. I also don't think the mother should be able to deny treatment that would most likely save his life.

And that's the thing - usually I would say that as sad as it is, the government has no right to force treatment on a 13 year old that doesn't want it. But this kid has been brainwashed. We can demonstrate that he doesn't know fact from fiction. At what point do we, as a society, have a responsibility to save him from himself, given his age?

inbetweendreams · May 2009

I don't understand how, as a parent, you wouldn't do every single thing you could to try to save your child's life, regardless of whether that is alternative or traditional medicine.

Mrs.Provost · May 2009

Rach03k:
Momma_S:
Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

Keep in mind that he has a learning disability and cannot read. I don't know what his disability is, but it is possible that he is not able to comprehend the situation. He didn't even believe he was sick.

With that said, I'm torn on this issue. I don't think the courts should be able to force them to take treatment. I also don't think the mother should be able to deny treatment that would most likely save his life.
And that's the thing - usually I would say that as sad as it is, the government has no right to force treatment on a 13 year old that doesn't want it. But this kid has been brainwashed. We can demonstrate that he doesn't know fact from fiction. At what point do we, as a society, have a responsibility to save him from himself, given his age?

And here comes the slippery slope.

I think MOST organized religions brainwash their children, too. So they shouldn't be allowed to do anything that is spiritually important to them, they should not be allowed to teach their children their beliefs, and they should be forced to do things MY way.

See the danger here? I do NOT believe that we as a society have the right to decide what is best for other people when it comes to their religious beliefs. We may not like it, but if you take away this family's religious freedom, then you take away yours and mine, too.

userdeleted · May 2009

Mrs.Provost:
Rach03k:
Momma_S:
Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

Keep in mind that he has a learning disability and cannot read. I don't know what his disability is, but it is possible that he is not able to comprehend the situation. He didn't even believe he was sick.

With that said, I'm torn on this issue. I don't think the courts should be able to force them to take treatment. I also don't think the mother should be able to deny treatment that would most likely save his life.
And that's the thing - usually I would say that as sad as it is, the government has no right to force treatment on a 13 year old that doesn't want it. But this kid has been brainwashed. We can demonstrate that he doesn't know fact from fiction. At what point do we, as a society, have a responsibility to save him from himself, given his age?
And here comes the slippery slope.
I think MOST organized religions brainwash their children, too. So they shouldn't be allowed to do anything that is spiritually important to them, they should not be allowed to teach their children their beliefs, and they should be forced to do things MY way.
See the danger here? I do NOT believe that we as a society have the right to decide what is best for other people when it comes to their religious beliefs. We may not like it, but if you take away this family's religious freedom, then you take away yours and mine, too.

I do see the danger and I know that in the end you're right. It's just frustrating to think that poor kid will die because his parents are nut jobs

Mrs.Provost · May 2009

Rach03k:
Mrs.Provost:
Rach03k:
Momma_S:
Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.

Keep in mind that he has a learning disability and cannot read. I don't know what his disability is, but it is possible that he is not able to comprehend the situation. He didn't even believe he was sick.

With that said, I'm torn on this issue. I don't think the courts should be able to force them to take treatment. I also don't think the mother should be able to deny treatment that would most likely save his life.
And that's the thing - usually I would say that as sad as it is, the government has no right to force treatment on a 13 year old that doesn't want it. But this kid has been brainwashed. We can demonstrate that he doesn't know fact from fiction. At what point do we, as a society, have a responsibility to save him from himself, given his age?
And here comes the slippery slope.
I think MOST organized religions brainwash their children, too. So they shouldn't be allowed to do anything that is spiritually important to them, they should not be allowed to teach their children their beliefs, and they should be forced to do things MY way.
See the danger here? I do NOT believe that we as a society have the right to decide what is best for other people when it comes to their religious beliefs. We may not like it, but if you take away this family's religious freedom, then you take away yours and mine, too.
I do see the danger and I know that in the end you're right. It's just frustrating to think that poor kid will die because his parents are nut jobs

I completely agree. It IS sad.

I have a very very dear friend who is Jehovas Witness. She just had her first baby last month. She's great about just answering my questions about her faith, and is always honest and open. I asked her in conversation how it would be handled if she started losing too much blood during labour/delivery (they dont believe in blood transfusions in any shape or form). She said, "Well if none of the other ways to deal with blood loss will work, then I would probably die". And she really seemed at peace with it.

I was HORRIFIED. I mean, just heartbroken. But she said that if someone forced her to have a transfusion, she would fear for her soul. I mean, doesn't make sense to me as a non-christian, but we can't force people to believe what we want them to believe, KWIM?

Sad story for sure though.

Amrice78 · May 2009

Mrs.Provost:

I was HORRIFIED. I mean, just heartbroken. But she said that if someone forced her to have a transfusion, she would fear for her soul. I mean, doesn't make sense to me as a non-christian, but we can't force people to believe what we want them to believe, KWIM?

Sad story for sure though.

Just an fyi - this is not universal Christian belief - in fact I've never heard of it before. It maybe just a JW belief.

lanie26 · May 2009

What is your age of consent? We don't have one in this province so if a child of any age wishes for treatment against his parents wishes, the gov't can intervene.

Mrs.Provost · May 2009

Amrice78:
Mrs.Provost:

I was HORRIFIED. I mean, just heartbroken. But she said that if someone forced her to have a transfusion, she would fear for her soul. I mean, doesn't make sense to me as a non-christian, but we can't force people to believe what we want them to believe, KWIM?

Sad story for sure though.

Just an fyi - this is not universal Christian belief - in fact I've never heard of it before. It maybe just a JW belief.

No I know this is just a JW thing. But to me, particularly because I don't even believe in the christian idea of a God OR in the bible, some religious beliefs sound completely wacky to me.

Amrice78 · May 2009

Mrs.Provost:
Amrice78:
Mrs.Provost:

I was HORRIFIED. I mean, just heartbroken. But she said that if someone forced her to have a transfusion, she would fear for her soul. I mean, doesn't make sense to me as a non-christian, but we can't force people to believe what we want them to believe, KWIM?

Sad story for sure though.

Just an fyi - this is not universal Christian belief - in fact I've never heard of it before. It maybe just a JW belief.

No I know this is just a JW thing. But to me, particularly because I don't even believe in the christian idea of a God OR in the bible, some religious beliefs sound completely wacky to me.

gotcha

Megsd721 · May 2009

Mrs.Provost:
Eek. I think it's a very scary scary slope to be sliding down to let any governing bodies FORCE medical treatment on someone who is unwilling.
This brings so? many things into play - religious freedom, freedom to choose one's own medical treatment, parents' rights to choose, and even when does a child get to decide for themselves.?
I really feel a bit sick thinking about courts being able to force someone to go against their moral and religious beliefs. We live in a country with the freedom to choose one's own religion - and that right HAS to be upheld, even when we may not personally agree with the choice the person is making.?
Further, the child in question is 13 - and I think he should absolutely get a say in what his treatment will be.?
People have rights, even when it makes us uncomfortable.?

Totally agree!!! ?Scary to think they are trying to force treatment.?

Mrs.Provost · May 2009

lanie26:
What is your age of consent? We don't have one in this province so if a child of any age wishes for treatment against his parents wishes, the gov't can intervene.

Yeah, I wonder too what their consenting age is. Because of what Lanie just mentioned, I definitely don't think our government would intervene if a child was in AGREEMENT with the parents.

Amrice78 · May 2009

Mrs.Provost:

lanie26:
What is your age of consent? We don't have one in this province so if a child of any age wishes for treatment against his parents wishes, the gov't can intervene.

Yeah, I wonder too what their consenting age is. Because of what Lanie just mentioned, I definitely don't think our government would intervene if a child was in AGREEMENT with the parents.

I'm not sure about medical consent, but other types is 16.

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