Big Green Lies- diapers

Temp76535187505890 · April 2009

Did anyone else watch this and was it already discussed? I'm watching it as I type this (I DVRed it) and they just talked about the great diaper debate.

They looked at it purely from an environment aspect not taking into account the health part of the argument at all.

They said from an environmental impact that it's equal and it mostly depends on where you live. For example, If your landfills are overflowing then cloth is the better option while if you live in areas where water is a scarce resource then disposables are better.

I dunno, I still dont think there's been a good study done either way taking EVERYTHING into account.

Hippinski · April 2009

I haven't seen it...but now I want to.

About the landfill thing though...so let's say the landfills aren't overflowing right now. What about in 50 years? 100 years? They might be then. It bugs the living crap out of me that people still have the 'well if it doesn't impact me what do I care attitude".

papagena · April 2009

Here's the one argument that always gets me wondering - I currently have purchased around 30 new diapers for DS. If I was doing disposables, at this point I would have purchased what - well over 2,200? I've got to think that the pollutants, water and energy created/used in the manufacturing process are worse in the production of 2K+ diapers than the washing I'm doing with the eco friendly detergent we use. Then, you add up the extra shipping (although, that may be negligable, since 2,500 diapers probably don't make up a truckload yet), the landfill space, the extra plastic used to throw away the diapers, the chemicals and poop that is sitting in the landfill, hopefully not contaminating the ground water.

I don't know - it's hard to believe it's an enviornmental wash...

pixy_stix · April 2009

Hippinski:
About the landfill thing though...so let's say the landfills aren't overflowing right now. What about in 50 years? 100 years? They might be then.

True, but you're also seeing a move towards more products being biodegradable and landfills allowing more air to hit the trash. They're also looking into new ways to fill landfills where the earth is turned back into an environmental sanctuary... at least in my area. So technology is moving forward as far as land-fills are concerned.

SAHolidayBride · April 2009

papagena:
Here's the one argument that always gets me wondering - I currently have purchased around 30 new diapers for DS.? If I was doing disposables, at this point I would have purchased what - well over 2,200?? I've got to think that the pollutants, water and energy created/used in the manufacturing process are worse in the production of 2K+ diapers than the washing I'm doing with the eco friendly detergent we use.? Then, you add up the extra shipping (although, that may be negligable, since 2,500 diapers probably don't make up a truckload yet), the landfill space, the extra plastic used to throw away the diapers, the chemicals and poop that is sitting in the landfill, hopefully not contaminating the ground water.?
I don't know - it's hard to believe it's an enviornmental wash...

?

That's exactly my argument! How can over 2000 of something be the same as <100 of the cloth version?? It just isn't logical. I'm so glad this board exists with other peope who better articulate my thoughts. ?

danaann78 · April 2009

No one ever screams "waste of water" when they're talking about washing their own underwear. I understand that I only wear one pair of undies a day as opposed to 10-12 diapers, but I feel that it's not a whole lot different than any other undergarments. And when potty training a kid can go through half a dozen or more pairs of undies a day, and again, no water-waste police are coming to get them.

goinggreengirl · April 2009

I agree that there isn't a good study covering all aspects. I can't imagine disposables coming out on top of a total study.

I grew up in a place that had an overabundance of water so I have a hard time thinking of water as a scarce resource. But I really just can't imagine that all those disposables sitting in a landfill could be an acceptable thing...

pixy_stix · April 2009

SAHolidayBride:
That's exactly my argument! How can over 2000 of something be the same as <100 of the cloth version?? It just isn't logical. I'm so glad this board exists with other peope who better articulate my thoughts.

It's the cotton that does it. Cotton farms are HUGE water sucks, not to mention the pesticides and farm equipment gas usage that goes into farvesting it. Cotton processing also is a huge waste of water.

Then you have the oil products that go into the manufacturing of PUL, etc.

sacaku · April 2009

ArmyQM:
They said from an environmental impact that it's equal and it mostly depends on where you live. For example, If your landfills are overflowing then cloth is the better option while if you live in areas where water is a scarce resource then disposables are better.??

?

I've been seeing this argument for awhile and something just doesn't sit right with me... so just b/c the landfill next you isn't completely full then its fine to keep putting waste into it (waste that doesn't breakdown for 500+years). ?that just doesn't make sense. ?Shouldn't the message be lets do everything we can NOT to get to that point and preserve the space we have for as long as we can??!! ?

It just seems like a lazy justification. ? ?

?

ETA: ?I just read through the response and see y'all have already touched on this... sorry - i got trigger happy when I read the post... its been on my mind for awhile. ?

Hippinski · April 2009

As I read more responses I have to question the amount of water and materials used in the production of disposables. The chemicals for the gels and such. To me it's more then just the landfill debate...it's the whole package.

But I also haven't had any tea yet today and am not able to put my thoughts into logical order. Sorry.

soontobecapek · April 2009

when I used sposies we tossed minimum 1 garbage bag full of dipes a week, so the garbage man with his stinky truck has to pick those up.. I get that he is already coming to my house, but really? I am already running the washing machine...

sacaku · April 2009

pixy_stix:
SAHolidayBride:
That's exactly my argument! How can over 2000 of something be the same as <100 of the cloth version?? It just isn't logical. I'm so glad this board exists with other peope who better articulate my thoughts. ?
It's the cotton that does it.? Cotton farms are HUGE water sucks, not to mention the pesticides and farm equipment gas usage that goes into farvesting it.? Cotton processing also is a huge waste of water.
Then you have the oil products that go into the manufacturing of PUL, etc.

?

Do you mind if I ask you what your alternative is then? I'm not trying to be snarky at all (i sincerely hope it doesn't come across that way)... just wondering. ?You seem to have a different take on this issue from what I've seen you post here and that interests me... plus you seem to be fairly educated on the matter.

papagena · April 2009

pixy_stix:
SAHolidayBride:
That's exactly my argument! How can over 2000 of something be the same as <100 of the cloth version?? It just isn't logical. I'm so glad this board exists with other peope who better articulate my thoughts.
It's the cotton that does it. Cotton farms are HUGE water sucks, not to mention the pesticides and farm equipment gas usage that goes into farvesting it. Cotton processing also is a huge waste of water.
Then you have the oil products that go into the manufacturing of PUL, etc.

But what about all the petroleum products used in disposable production?

Like your other post said - there's no way that a human life will not have some effect on our environment... Perhaps it is a wash - but it's so hard to believe it is...

pixy_stix · April 2009

soontobecapek:
when I used sposies we tossed minimum 1 garbage bag full of dipes a week, so the garbage man with his stinky truck has to pick those up.. I get that he is already coming to my house, but really? I am already running the washing machine...

You also live in an area where there is no shortage of water, so YOUR environmental impact is less than if you were using sposies.

soontobecapek · April 2009

pixy_stix:
soontobecapek:

when I used sposies we tossed minimum 1 garbage bag full of dipes a week, so the garbage man with his stinky truck has to pick those up.. I get that he is already coming to my house, but really? I am already running the washing machine...

You also live in an area where there is no shortage of water, so YOUR environmental impact is less than if you were using sposies.

definitely no shortage here...

soontobecapek · April 2009

pixy_stix:
soontobecapek:

when I used sposies we tossed minimum 1 garbage bag full of dipes a week, so the garbage man with his stinky truck has to pick those up.. I get that he is already coming to my house, but really? I am already running the washing machine...

You also live in an area where there is no shortage of water, so YOUR environmental impact is less than if you were using sposies.

definitely no shortage here...

AmandaHearn · April 2009

Personally, even if they take the same amount of resources, I would still say cloth is better simply because once they are made you use mostly renewable resources to take care of them. That beats sitting in a landfill for 500+ years in my book any day.

sacaku · April 2009

AmandaHearn:
Personally, even if they take the same amount of resources, I would still say cloth is better simply because once they are made you use mostly renewable resources to take care of them.? That beats sitting in a landfill for 500+ years in my book any day.

?

exactly... a family with multiple children will only have to purchase one stash and reuse those for future children- and then you can sell those another family once done. ?with disposables you have to keep purchasing new diapers with each child... so the number of disposables used would grow exponentially. ?It may be the same at the initial output... but CD is vastly better (IMO) in the long run. ?

goinggreengirl · April 2009

Also, there are more eco friendly options within cloth diapering. Buying unbleached prefolds, using wool covers. Buying locally made diapers or making your own. You can even use old material (cotten t-shirts, etc). That is VERY eco friendly!

papagena · April 2009

sacaku:
AmandaHearn:
Personally, even if they take the same amount of resources, I would still say cloth is better simply because once they are made you use mostly renewable resources to take care of them. That beats sitting in a landfill for 500+ years in my book any day.

exactly... a family with multiple children will only have to purchase one stash and reuse those for future children- and then you can sell those another family once done. with disposables you have to keep purchasing new diapers with each child... so the number of disposables used would grow exponentially. It may be the same at the initial output... but CD is vastly better (IMO) in the long run.

Ditto this...

Dobie_Mama · April 2009

sacaku:
pixy_stix:
SAHolidayBride:
That's exactly my argument! How can over 2000 of something be the same as <100 of the cloth version?? It just isn't logical. I'm so glad this board exists with other peope who better articulate my thoughts.
It's the cotton that does it. Cotton farms are HUGE water sucks, not to mention the pesticides and farm equipment gas usage that goes into farvesting it. Cotton processing also is a huge waste of water.
Then you have the oil products that go into the manufacturing of PUL, etc.

Do you mind if I ask you what your alternative is then? I'm not trying to be snarky at all (i sincerely hope it doesn't come across that way)... just wondering. You seem to have a different take on this issue from what I've seen you post here and that interests me... plus you seem to be fairly educated on the matter.

I was going to ask this too. I admit I'm totally lame and know nothing about cotton farming, really. So, would it be more EF to use a CD that is mostly say, bamboo or hemp or something, rather than cotton?

Lotte134 · April 2009

They should also figure in the fact that many people buy used cloth which significantly cuts down the impact of making the cloth diapers. I think I own a total of 5 new diapers out of my stash (around 30 total, I think). I also will resell everything when I'm done with it so it will get more use.

gymdog81 · April 2009

I understand the water shortage thing to a certain extent, but it is still a renewable resource, whereas thousands of diapers in a landfill do not degrade for a LONG time. In the amount of time it would take one childs disposables to biodegrade, the amount of water I had used to wash my cloth diapers will have been renewed many times over (especially living in an area where they recycle as much water as they can).

Temp76535187505890 · April 2009

Sorry, I posted and had to run....

I didnt really mean to rehash the debate but wanted to see if anyone had seen the show last night. I still have yet to watch the rest where they talk about VOCs, hybrids and I think one other topic.

The show said that the average child goes through 8000 disposables and they didnt touch at all on how they rarely (or dont at all) biodegrade but just how they fill up the landfill. One mother said she did research and since diapers only contributed to less than 2% of the overall products in the landfill then she felt it was ok to use disposables. She also talked about how we dont share underwear so why should our children.....eluding to the use of diaper services reusing diapers for multiple children. They didnt even discuss washing at home. So many things went unsaid on both sides of the issue. I think the whole show was only an hour so the diaper part was maybe 7-8 minutes total including commercials.

Oh and one statistic they used was that cloth diaperers use an average of 27% more water than disposable users.

I dont know, like I said. I'd like to see a difinitive study done on all the things you all touched on to include the downsides of what it takes to produce and wash cloth diapers.

outnumbered · April 2009

understand the water shortage thing to a certain extent, but it is still a renewable resource,

Sorry if this gets posted twice. I tried before and nothing showed up. I am just starting to research CDs for child #3. I cannot stand the thought of spending more money on disp. and taking up space in a land fill, but global water shortage is a very real threat. At least 36 states are expected to face water shortages within the next five years, according to U.S. government estimates and the worldwide estimates of H2O shortage is terrible. Google water shortage. It is scary. these are just a few articles

https://www.alternet.org/water/82378/

https://whyfiles.org/131fresh_water/2.html

https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Worldwide_Water_Shortage_On_Horizon_999.html

pixy_stix · April 2009

outnumbered:
understand the water shortage thing to a certain extent, but it is still a renewable resource,

Sorry if this gets posted twice. I tried before and nothing showed up. I am just starting to research CDs for child #3. I cannot stand the thought of spending more money on disp. and taking up space in a land fill, but global water shortage is a very real threat. At least 36 states are expected to face water shortages within the next five years, according to U.S. government estimates and the worldwide estimates of H2O shortage is terrible. Google water shortage. It is scary. these are just a few articles

https://www.alternet.org/water/82378/

https://whyfiles.org/131fresh_water/2.html

https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Worldwide_Water_Shortage_On_Horizon_999.html

Exactly, thank you!

Water is NOT a renewable resource. It's a finite resource. Unfortunately, a lot of people do not understand this. Yes, our Earth is covered mostly in water, but most of it is unusable. The treatment of salt water is very costly in both $$ and environmental resources.

Want a personalized experience?

Big Green Lies- diapers

Re: Big Green Lies- diapers

Choose Another Board

Search Boards