I haz a confession.

kcisthebombdotcom · May 2013

I abhor the mentality that exists about the c-section culture in this country. I lurk on the tri boards and there's always this groupthink that the skyrocketing csection rate is due to doctors who push unsuspecting moms into sections so they can make it to the golf course on time. There's always the comparisons of how it's obviously unnecessary since third world countries have low section rates with low mortality rates. The issue is everyone avoids the facts of American culture- the majority of women of childbearing age are overweight with a good percentage being obese. Women are having children later in life. We have technology which lets us detect potential problems whereas those children might have passed in utero elsewhere. It's a cultural issue, not a doctor issue. I think a lot of women will end up ignoring medical advice that's appropriate for their baby and their situation because they read general recommendations on the Internet.

does this annoy anyone else, or am I the only one?

bumpuser8448316 · May 2013

Just to make sure I understand...

your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?

bumpuser8448316 · May 2013

sing4mysavior:
QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?

for me, it's just that there's a cultural mindset that sections are almost never needed and that they ONLY happen bc a doc is in a hurry, when really, lots of factors come into play. i certainly don't think anyone should be pressured into a csection, but if baby or mom will benefit/reduce negative outcomes...then of course a c is the answer....like i said...just so many people seem to "know so much better than their doc" (on many issues) nowadays....

No, I totally agree that there is a mindset that either C sections are unnecessary at all times or that C sections are done for the doctor's convenience.

I've just never seen anything suggesting that the problem is with overweight older mothers....

Deblondie1 · May 2013

Mermaids&Magic:
My confession is i don't get why anyone else gives a rat's tiny hairless @ss about anyone else's labor. I only care about my labor and delivery. When people go on and on about c-section rates and the like all I think about is "it's my uterus. I'll figure out how to best expel the human inside it. TYVM"

Scoot over. I want to sit on this bench with you.

ETA: And are we really shocked KC thinks it's because of fat people?

chelseymat · May 2013

I agree to some extent. My MIL spent time in Kenya and while they have no drs to do the sections and infant mortality from birth is still relatively low they have a very high occurrence of cerebral palsy from complications resulting from no prenatal care.

A c section is not the worst thing in the world. Do some drs do them more then necessary? probably. But if you and the baby end up perfectly healthy, I don't get the dramatic concern with how the kid got here.

jensriot · May 2013

Mermaids&Magic:
My confession is i don't get why anyone else gives a rat's tiny hairless @ss about anyone else's labor. I only care about my labor and delivery. When people go on and on about c-section rates and the like all I think about is "it's my uterus. I'll figure out how to best expel the human inside it. TYVM"

This is my thought. Exactly.

CinemaGoddess · May 2013

In this same vein, people who want c-sections, who have done their research (online or speaking to a doctor), and are set on that path should be granted it. Like someone upthread said, how a woman chooses to expel a child from her uterus is her business, not everyone else's.

bumpuser8448316 · May 2013

scatteredtrees:
Deblondie1:
Mermaids&Magic:
My confession is i don't get why anyone else gives a rat's tiny hairless @ss about anyone else's labor. I only care about my labor and delivery. When people go on and on about c-section rates and the like all I think about is "it's my uterus. I'll figure out how to best expel the human inside it. TYVM"
Scoot over. I want to sit on this bench with you.
ETA: And are we really shocked KC thinks it's because of fat people?
Moreover, are we shocked KC has an offensive/obnoxius opinion on something?

Honestly, even though it's KC I am a bit shocked that she would actually present this as legit. I mean, really?

sbevmc09 · May 2013

I think that the issue is often oversimplified. It's a very complex issue. But the rates are totally, totally out of control and don't benefit the people we should be focused on (i.e. mothers and babies).

sbevmc09 · May 2013

Mermaids&Magic:
My confession is i don't get why anyone else gives a rat's tiny hairless @ss about anyone else's labor. I only care about my labor and delivery. When people go on and on about c-section rates and the like all I think about is "it's my uterus. I'll figure out how to best expel the human inside it. TYVM"

I'll speak to this, I care about other people's birthing experiences because our current model of care is not set up to benefit women and babies. It would be awesome if you could just waltz into an office and trust your care provider, but again, it's such a complicated issue and you have to be in a position to advocate for yourself. If no one talks about these things then how will we ever know there's room for improvement?

If you make and educated, informed decision (whatever that is), more power to you. But not everyone gets that opportunity with the current model of care. That's where the problem lies.

notkateanymore · May 2013

QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?

LOL I like how you worded it better.

notkateanymore · May 2013

What I don't get is why it's anybody's business except the mother, her partner and her doctor. Why do you care what the reason is? Why are you obsessed with fat people?

notkateanymore · May 2013

CnAmom:
QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?
I don't know why, but that made me LOL.

What really gets under my skin is when someone insists on major surgery for ridiculous reasons like wanting to have a baby on a certain day, or not wanting the "hassle" of being in labor and having a baby vaginally.

I had a c/s with DS1 because he wouldn't be here if I hadn't. You can bet your asss that I would have delivered vaginally if the circumstances had been different.

Silly reasons? Yes, but why does it bother you? Who cares!

sbevmc09 · May 2013

KateMW:
Why are you obsessed with fat people?

*snort*

Sorry, that was unladylike.

:P

CinemaGoddess · May 2013

KateMW:
What I don't get is why it's anybody's business except the mother, her partner and her doctor. Why do you care what the reason is? Why are you obsessed with fat people?

KC cares.

Deeply.

Did she tell you how she used to be fat but then lost weight and it was totes easy and people who fail at diets don't make good life decisions? Also, people who lost money on homes or lost their jobs.

It all comes back to making good life decisions.

notkateanymore · May 2013

CinemaGoddess:
KateMW:
What I don't get is why it's anybody's business except the mother, her partner and her doctor. Why do you care what the reason is? Why are you obsessed with fat people?
KC cares.
Deeply.
Did she tell you how she used to be fat but then lost weight and it was totes easy and people who fail at diets don't make good life decisions? Also, people who lost money on homes or lost their jobs.
It all comes back to making good life decisions.

YGPM

Deblondie1 · May 2013

CinemaGoddess:
KateMW:
What I don't get is why it's anybody's business except the mother, her partner and her doctor. Why do you care what the reason is? Why are you obsessed with fat people?
KC cares.
Deeply.
Did she tell you how she used to be fat but then lost weight and it was totes easy and people who fail at diets don't make good life decisions? Also, people who lost money on homes or lost their jobs.
It all comes back to making good life decisions.

Bootstraps!

sbevmc09 · May 2013

KateMW:
CnAmom:
QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?
I don't know why, but that made me LOL.

What really gets under my skin is when someone insists on major surgery for ridiculous reasons like wanting to have a baby on a certain day, or not wanting the "hassle" of being in labor and having a baby vaginally.

I had a c/s with DS1 because he wouldn't be here if I hadn't. You can bet your asss that I would have delivered vaginally if the circumstances had been different.
Silly reasons? Yes, but why does it bother you? Who cares!

You know, I'll be honest, those things get under my skin too. However, I think they really get under my skin because too often people make that decision without really understanding the pros/cons. It's like, hey! Let's just have a C/S! Easy peasy! But they don't understand the risks they're taking on, the future complications they might experience, etc. I'm not saying this is true for ALL women, but I know that many doctors treat medical interventions as things not to be concerned with. They just present it as an option and that's that. I just think that informed consent is the important thing here. You want a C/S because you want your baby born today? It's your body and your baby, go for it. But I think the care providers need to make sure that the parent(s) understand what making that decision means.

notkateanymore · May 2013

JellyBellyStar:
KateMW:
CnAmom:
QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?
I don't know why, but that made me LOL.

What really gets under my skin is when someone insists on major surgery for ridiculous reasons like wanting to have a baby on a certain day, or not wanting the "hassle" of being in labor and having a baby vaginally.

I had a c/s with DS1 because he wouldn't be here if I hadn't. You can bet your asss that I would have delivered vaginally if the circumstances had been different.
Silly reasons? Yes, but why does it bother you? Who cares!
Silly reasons? Yes. Do I think someone who tells me any of the above reasons is an idiot? Yes. Do I care? No b/c I recognize that they are an idiot.

Exactly. There are far more important things to get up in arms about...like pouches! And car seat safety. I also think that my opinion of this is different bc I was maybe pushed into having a section for all the wrong reasons but everything turned out fine...as it usually does.

emeraldanchor · May 2013

I had a csection because my child was breech. I'm not overweight or old. To assume that's the reason is ridiculous. Forgive me for not coming on here to get opinions on how MY labor and birth experience should be.

Seriously, far more things to be worried about.

I have a close friend who has such a hatred for csections. Her and her husband post how they're the devil and its made me really distance myself from them.

notkateanymore · May 2013

sbevmc09:
KateMW:
CnAmom:
QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?
I don't know why, but that made me LOL.

What really gets under my skin is when someone insists on major surgery for ridiculous reasons like wanting to have a baby on a certain day, or not wanting the "hassle" of being in labor and having a baby vaginally.

I had a c/s with DS1 because he wouldn't be here if I hadn't. You can bet your asss that I would have delivered vaginally if the circumstances had been different.
Silly reasons? Yes, but why does it bother you? Who cares!
You know, I'll be honest, those things get under my skin too. However, I think they really get under my skin because too often people make that decision without really understanding the pros/cons. It's like, hey! Let's just have a C/S! Easy peasy! But they don't understand the risks they're taking on, the future complications they might experience, etc. I'm not saying this is true for ALL women, but I know that many doctors treat medical interventions as things not to be concerned with. They just present it as an option and that's that. I just think that informed consent is the important thing here. You want a C/S because you want your baby born today? It's your body and your baby, go for it. But I think the care providers need to make sure that the parent(s) understand what making that decision means.

I assume people that have made these decisions have thought it through enough to still make the decision and that's good enough for me. Of course, it also has to do with my stance on abortion...if you tell somebody their reasons for an c/s aren't good enough, I feel like its only a couple of steps away from it being OK to tell somebody what's a good enough reason for an abortion. It's my body and everything that happens in it, to it and in regards to it is my business.

CinemaGoddess · May 2013

CnAmom:
KateMW:
CnAmom:
QueSyrah:
Just to make sure I understand...
your problem is that people think OBs are pushing c sections for their own convenience but its really because people are old and fat?
I don't know why, but that made me LOL.

What really gets under my skin is when someone insists on major surgery for ridiculous reasons like wanting to have a baby on a certain day, or not wanting the "hassle" of being in labor and having a baby vaginally.

I had a c/s with DS1 because he wouldn't be here if I hadn't. You can bet your asss that I would have delivered vaginally if the circumstances had been different.
Silly reasons? Yes, but why does it bother you? Who cares!
I don't know! It's just crazy to me that anyone would choose to have a major surgery when there isn't really a good reason for it. I normally don't care what other people do w/r/t having babies, but that one thing just really gets stuck in my craw.

It's nice having a normal sized vagina, tho.

dragossoul84 · May 2013

Like everything in life you should make an informed decision. I had a totally different experience than I wanted when I went in to give birth to DS. I started wanting no assistance and to go natural. Then because of my gall bladder gearing up to burst and my blood pressure going nuts my Dr decided I should be induced. The pain got so bad during the induction I did go with pain medication after a long time and then the induction failed and they told me the best thing for my son was a c-section. I did what every mother does whats best for her child and it was hard an painful I cried when I got up to walk the next morning and I did have part of my stitches bust at home. I may have a c-section for my next child I'm still doing research on VBAC. There was nothing convenient about my labor for myself or the dr.

sbevmc09 · May 2013

KateMW:
Of course, it also has to do with my stance on abortion...if you tell somebody their reasons for an c/s aren't good enough, I feel like its only a couple of steps away from it being OK to tell somebody what's a good enough reason for an abortion. It's my body and everything that happens in it, to it and in regards to it is my business.

I totally see what you're saying. While I don't necessary agree with some choices that women make I would absolutely support their right to making that decision regardless.

That's why I'm all about informed consent I think it really goes back to that. A care provider should have to sit down and really discuss options with women, not just breeze in and out with some paperwork for them to sign near the X. Some do this and that's great! But others don't. That's the real problem. I think some women think that it doesn't matter how a baby comes out, it's all the same. It isn't. Again, it's a complicated issue and there are pros and cons to everything. But that's why women really need to be given the opportunity to make an informed decision with the guidance of a trusted, knowledgeable provider. Not everyone gets that.

bumpuser8448316 · May 2013

Why does everyone just assume that anyone having a c section hasn't done their research? I mean, I'm not a huge fan of inductions/c sections for non medically necessary reasons, but at the same time I have never met anyone who just blindly walked into birthing their baby having done NO research and just did whatever their doctor said. Maybe I just make good choices with the people I associate with, heh.

If I posted on my BMB that I was having a c section, 95% of the responses would be why? Did your doctor say its necessary? Did you do spinning babies? What about a chiro experienced with Webster technique? External version? Not one person would assume I had done my own research, talked it over with my doctor and come to a decision.

notkateanymore · May 2013

sbevmc09:
KateMW:
Of course, it also has to do with my stance on abortion...if you tell somebody their reasons for an c/s aren't good enough, I feel like its only a couple of steps away from it being OK to tell somebody what's a good enough reason for an abortion. It's my body and everything that happens in it, to it and in regards to it is my business.
I totally see what you're saying. While I don't necessary agree with some choices that women make I would absolutely support their right to making that decision regardless.
That's why I'm all about informed consent I think it really goes back to that. A care provider should have to sit down and really discuss options with women, not just breeze in and out with some paperwork for them to sign near the X. Some do this and that's great! But others don't. That's the real problem. I think some women think that it doesn't matter how a baby comes out, it's all the same. It isn't. Again, it's a complicated issue and there are pros and cons to everything. But that's why women really need to be given the opportunity to make an informed decision with the guidance of a trusted, knowledgeable provider. Not everyone gets that.

Totally agree. In a perfect world, that happens but we all know it just doesn't.

penguingrrl · May 2013

LalaMama81:
LoisLayn23:
I had a csection due to fetal distress. While I think some OB's do get section happy, I also hate the notion that my csection wasn't medically necessary or emergent. It was both.
Do you really think anyone thinks a section in that circumstance wasn't necessary? Plenty of c sections are done that aren't medically necessary.

I'm pretty sure my c section was not medically indicated. I was told she was stuck, but two vaginal births later and I'm pretty sure my OB was just making me push long before my body was ready.

I think that doctors like the idiot who delivered my first are few and far between. Most doctors treat c sections as the necessary life-saving step that it really is. I do think many people overestimate how many doctors use it unnecessarily.

I also think that the numbers are very skewed. NYC is a very natural-birth friendly city yet the hospitals there have high C section rates. I personally assume that's a feature of having premier hospitals that people come to to deliver from out of town because mom and/or baby is at risk or has a serious known problem. They schedule delivery with the right neonatal specialist waiting to take the baby right into surgery.

sbevmc09 · May 2013

QueSyrah:
Why does everyone just assume that anyone having a c section hasn't done their research? I mean, I'm not a huge fan of inductions/c sections for non medically necessary reasons, but at the same time I have never met anyone who just blindly walked into birthing their baby having done NO research and just did whatever their doctor said. Maybe I just make good choices with the people I associate with, heh.
If I posted on my BMB that I was having a c section, 95% of the responses would be why? Did your doctor say its necessary? Did you do spinning babies? What about a chiro experienced with Webster technique? External version? Not one person would assume I had done my own research, talked it over with my doctor and come to a decision.

I've known plenty of women who haven't done a stitch of research about pregnancy/childbirth. Some came out the other side totally happy with great experiences, some didn't.

I think that, especially on a message board, people are just trying to be helpful. They don't know what you've heard of and what you haven't. I know when I suggest things it's not because I automatically assume that someone hasn't made an informed decision, but more JIC they haven't heard of XYZ. I mean, sure, some people are just obnoxious and like to give themselves pats on the back by trying to seem superior to others, but I think that it varies. Some people are really just trying to raise awareness, not offend people or make them feel judged.

And, like with anything else, you have to realize that others' opinions don't matter. You know your circumstances and you're the only one who gets to make the decision. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.

LatteLady5 · May 2013

Mermaids&Magic:
My confession is i don't get why anyone else gives a rat's tiny hairless @ss about anyone else's labor. I only care about my labor and delivery. When people go on and on about c-section rates and the like all I think about is "it's my uterus. I'll figure out how to best expel the human inside it. "

I agree with this. I think it's ridiculous that anyone cares that much about how another woman's baby got here.

notkateanymore · May 2013

Hav=Fath:
KC - Why do you care how other babies are born?
Why do you hate fat people? Especially if you were once fat, seems like you'd be even more understanding.
And why did you post something like this and then not come back to discuss it further?

I'm pretty sure the answer to the third one is because she likes to stir up ***.

CinemaGoddess · May 2013

CnAmom:
You know what's really unfair? I was in the home stretch with a vaginal delivery when they realized that his head was stuck in my pelvic bone to the point that there was no way he was making his exit that way. He started having decels so they wheeled me off the the OR. long story short, I got the surgery AND the stretched out vagina.

You have all my sorries. For serious.

Cherryblossoms07 · May 2013

Eh. I had a csection because DS was breech and I also had OBs push for a csection for reason other than medical. My first pushed because DD's EDD was so close to Christmas. Starting in my first trimester she started coming into the room asking if I scheduled my csection yet because her schedule for the holidays was booking up. I kept telling her I wanted to have a natural child birth and she would drop it until the next visit when she asked again. Then low and behold I became classified as high risk and a csection was scheduled without my knowledge. When I asked why I had a csection scheduled and why I was high risk, they had no idea. After hounding the office and OB about the matter my record was finally cleared and the csection cancelled. The OB was not happy about the matter. That OB was the top rated OB in the area. I went to another OB when I was pregnant with DS, another Christmas baby, and was asked if I wanted to schedule a csection so I could be certain I wouldn't be in the hospital over Christmas. So, I have experienced the push to schedule. I am not saying all OBs do it and to say OBs always/never push csections is oversimplifying things.

notkateanymore · May 2013

cjcouple:
I have never had to justify my section. Who are you people talking to? Lol

This! And I was probably induced bc my doctor was going to Italy.

shibby00 · May 2013

scatteredtrees:
No babies for fat people?

Fat OLD people.

sbevmc09 · May 2013

Cherryblossoms07:
Eh. I had a csection because DS was breech and I also had OBs push for a csection for reason other than medical. My first pushed because DD's EDD was so close to Christmas. Starting in my first trimester she started coming into the room asking if I scheduled my csection yet because her schedule for the holidays was booking up. I kept telling her I wanted to have a natural child birth and she would drop it until the next visit when she asked again. Then low and behold I became classified as high risk and a csection was scheduled without my knowledge. When I asked why I had a csection scheduled and why I was high risk, they had no idea. After hounding the office and OB about the matter my record was finally cleared and the csection cancelled. The OB was not happy about the matter. That OB was the top rated OB in the area. I went to another OB when I was pregnant with DS, another Christmas baby, and was asked if I wanted to schedule a csection so I could be certain I wouldn't be in the hospital over Christmas. So, I have experienced the push to schedule. I am not saying all OBs do it and to say OBs always/never push csections is oversimplifying things.

This is the kind of stuff that really gets to me. This should never, ever happen. Thankfully you knew to question it, but think of how many women have probably been in a similar situation and ended up with C/S they didn't want and possibly with complications that never should have happened.

trizzie · May 2013

KateMW:
cjcouple:
I have never had to justify my section. Who are you people talking to? Lol
This! And I was probably induced bc my doctor was going to Italy.

i never have either. And I have never had to justify that I, GASP, FF both kids.

vlagrl29 · May 2013

For me, I get annoyed that everyone thinks c/sections are some horrible bad thing that you should avoid at all cost. Sorry, but I prefer to be in a hospital and if I've pushed for 3.5 hours trying to get a kid with a huge head out and my doctors advised I get a c/section, sign me up. I'm so happy to get another section next time not having to go thru all that distress again.

vlagrl29 · May 2013

trizzie:
KateMW:
cjcouple:
I have never had to justify my section. Who are you people talking to? Lol
This! And I was probably induced bc my doctor was going to Italy.
i never have either. And I have never had to justify that I, GASP, FF both kids.

OMG, me too! AND I forward faced shortly after year...flame me now!

notkateanymore · May 2013

shibby00:
scatteredtrees:
No babies for fat people?
Fat OLD people.

Why do you hate Santa, KC.

Andrewsgal · May 2013

shibby00:
scatteredtrees:
No babies for fat people?
Fat OLD people.

Fat, old, poor people.

SwimSurfSmile · May 2013

I am in the group of doing what ever it takes for healthy baby and mom.

I also think it is everyone's responsibility to advocate for themselves and find a doctor they trust. I know that can be hard for some, speaking up or even finding a doctor due to insurance or distance or whatever.

I guess I'm lucky I had a birth in the hospital and the doctors and nurses were my cheerleaders for my natural birth. I pushed for two hours and asked about a csection, my doctor said I was doing great, my son was fine and to keep pushing. Maybe if I had a different doctor things would of been different?

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I haz a confession.

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