I was just thinking about "the pain Olympics"

vanessagorc

This is not a $hit stirring post.  But I was just thinking about this. It's a phrase that gets tossed around a lot.  I think people sometimes fail to see, that nobody actually wants to win (or even compete in the pain Olympics). 

 And offen the people "poo poo-ing it" didn't even qualify for them.  

It's not about "your journey wasn't hard enough" we ALL wish we were the luckier ones.  1 Iui or 1 Ivf is just different than multiple failures.  It's not that anyone here begrudges someone faster success.  It's about the cruelty of how unfair this journey is to some of us.  It bares repeating, it's just a different journey.  I feel so lucky to have made it (almost) the other side.  Why me, and not so many others?  I don't know?  But I sure as hell know, that I'm damn lucky.

Ok, stepping off my soapbox.... 

 

NMscubagirl

I F-ing HATE that saying and it is only the same type of people who use the phrase "no drama" while starting drama that use it. How dare someone tell anyone that they are using their pain to compete is some type of competition!  There are simply different levels of things in life, any things. Good things, bad things, horrible things. It just is. And if you aren't on that precipice where things really really suck, don't belittle them by saying that your 2 steps toward it is the same thing and then judge someone when they try to point out it isn't. 

vanessagorc

NMscubagirl:

I F-ing HATE that saying and it is only the same type of people who use the phrase "no drama" while starting drama that use it. How dare someone tell anyone that they are using their pain to compete is some type of competition!  There are simply different levels of things in life, any things. Good things, bad things, horrible things. It just is. And if you aren't on that precipice where things really really suck, don't belittle them by saying that your 2 steps toward it is the same thing and then judge someone when they try to point out it isn't. 

. Sort of like saying "no offense" and then unleashing the most offensive comments ever. 

NMscubagirl

vanessagorc:

NMscubagirl:

I F-ing HATE that saying and it is only the same type of people who use the phrase "no drama" while starting drama that use it. How dare someone tell anyone that they are using their pain to compete is some type of competition!  There are simply different levels of things in life, any things. Good things, bad things, horrible things. It just is. And if you aren't on that precipice where things really really suck, don't belittle them by saying that your 2 steps toward it is the same thing and then judge someone when they try to point out it isn't. 

. Sort of like saying "no offense" and then unleashing the most offensive comments ever. 

yup - or "with all due respect" and then being incredibly disrespectful. I could go on forever

Gregermis

Mrs.McIrish

I have been thinking a lot about "where do I go from here". The reality is that not everyone makes it to the other side. Where do they go after treatment? Disappear like they don't exist? People don't want to talk about those people. In about 72 hrs, that will be my reality and I have no clue. This will be lifetime pain that is just different from someone who did one IVF and it worked.

mm29

Mrs.McIrish:

I have been thinking a lot about "where do I go from here". The reality is that not everyone makes it to the other side. Where do they go after treatment? Disappear like they don't exist? People don't want to talk about those people. In about 72 hrs, that will be my reality and I have no clue. This will be lifetime pain that is just different from someone who did one IVF and it worked.

I really hope you "make it to the other side!"  We need some miracles around these parts.  I hope you announce your miracle soon!!!  (((Huge hugs))). 

 

Please stick around if things do not work out, if you can!  I hate it when ppl disappear!!!

 

Mrkyrain

I think about this a lot. Fighting IF for years is life changing. I dont think one can truly understand unless they have also fought the fight. Even after, the affects are still there. I know how lucky I am. I was told often: less than 3 percent chance/ odds the same for trying on your own as doing this last IVF. Even though I have almost (getting closer) made it to "the other side", I spend this pregnancy feeling blessed but also wondering why me? There is some guilt about why I was so lucky and so many other wonderful ladies haven't been. There is also terror that I'm sure other pregnant women don't feel. I hope this doesn't come off as complaining because I know what it means to have made it this far. I am more saying that I am IFV for life and I am hoping for you ladies everyday and also continue to hope for myself.

Edwina.McDunnough

Saying that all pain is equal is condescending. I completely understand that there are levels of grief that I have not experienced and I know that experiences I have suffered through seem light compared to others. I also look back at my own very painful IVF failures and think they were a piece of cake compared to my DE failures (lesson: there's always more). It seems like the people that are the most defensive of their suffering are the ones that have suffered the least. Again, not to deny that they haven't suffered and not that their suffering isn't acute. However, certain experiences are profound and for someone who has not had these experiences to equate themselves to the other is belittling and insulting to say the least.

vanessagorc

I see it like this, my 3rd failed Ivf was harder than my 2nd.  When I  was going thru my 1st, I had no idea what a fourth would feel like.  

I also have no idea how hard a failed de cycle would be , bc I didn't experience it. 

But that's the whole point. I DON'T know. Nor should I pretend I would have any frame of reference.  That's what I like about vets.  Nobody condescends and tells people thu should "get over it" and not compare pain.  It's about knowing  u don't know $hit about how hard some things are, being grateful that u don't have to know that pain, and being supportive of the ones who have been forced to know that pain. 

Mrs.McIrish

Edwina.McDunnough:

Saying that all pain is equal is condescending. I completely understand that there are levels of grief that I have not experienced and I know that experiences I have suffered through seem light compared to others. I also look back at my own very painful IVF failures and think they were a piece of cake compared to my DE failures (lesson: there's always more). It seems like the people that are the most defensive of their suffering are the ones that have suffered the least. Again, not to deny that they haven't suffered and not that their suffering isn't acute. However, certain experiences are profound and for someone who has not had these experiences to equate themselves to the other is belittling and insulting to say the least.

Big hugs. I think of you, Reb and Krod (and Hollymichael even though she doesn't know me) all the time when I'm feeling sorry for myself. You are sadly correct that there can always be more and bigger failures which just plain sucks.

Edwina.McDunnough

My 4th was easiest.

What I appreciate V is that even though you don't know the exact experience, you do know that it sucks and it's painful in it's OWN way. 

And don't put down your cycles, it was and is hard every step of the way. 

vanessagorc

Edwina.McDunnough:

My 4th was easiest.

What I appreciate V is that even though you don't know the exact experience, you do know that it sucks and it's painful in it's OWN way. 

And don't put down your cycles, it was and is hard every step of the way. 

thanks e!  I know it was hard, but I also know there  is harder.  I think that's probably compassion and empathy...often lacking on some of the posts I've seen (not here). 

Edwina.McDunnough

And getting back to your original, why people WANT to be IF of IFV is just beyond me. Who am I to deny someone the pleasure of multiple failed cycles or gold status posting exclusively on the IF board, be my guest. 

I also acknowledge there "is harder" doesn't make anyone feel particularly better at the moment either. It's a kind of perspective and sanity that is beyond reach when you're in the middle of it all.

BTW Vee is magic mike playing in IMAX 3d?

McIrish, many thanks and hugs to you. I know that you don't have to have XXX procedure to sympathize with being truly at the end of your rope. It's just heartbreaking that any of us are facing this option. 

reb259

Mrs.McIrish:

Edwina.McDunnough:

Saying that all pain is equal is condescending. I completely understand that there are levels of grief that I have not experienced and I know that experiences I have suffered through seem light compared to others. I also look back at my own very painful IVF failures and think they were a piece of cake compared to my DE failures (lesson: there's always more). It seems like the people that are the most defensive of their suffering are the ones that have suffered the least. Again, not to deny that they haven't suffered and not that their suffering isn't acute. However, certain experiences are profound and for someone who has not had these experiences to equate themselves to the other is belittling and insulting to say the least.

Big hugs. I think of you, Reb and Krod (and Hollymichael even though she doesn't know me) all the time when I'm feeling sorry for myself. You are sadly correct that there can always be more and bigger failures which just plain sucks.

thanks Mcirish!  I still get emotional very easily and can't really put together a response that can focus on what i want to say, my thoughts are all over.  But I did want to say a few things I personally feel:

• I have never really experienced a loss.  I can't even imagine, that is IMO an unfairness I can't even justify in my head

 

• DE failure is so hard because by this point you have compromised so much and it is what is "supposed" to finally work and when it doesnt it makes you question EVERYTHING

 

• IFV to me is not about time but rather experience.   I admit I have a hard time when I see women getting pregnant after IUI's, TI, or even 1 IVF.  I try every day to be a bigger person but by not allowing myself to feel this bitterness also makes me feel like I am cheating myself out of feeling what and how I feel

 

• Maybe there should be a Pregnant after TTC

 

• I have changed so much as a person and I have said before, I am not sure I like all facets of who I am today.  But I am the way I am because I have experienced a loss, one that many people experience everyday without any problems or issues. 

 

• I love what E said... "However, certain experiences are profound and for someone who has not had these experiences to equate themselves to the other is belittling and insulting to say the least."

vanessagorc

Yep...who wants to IF?!  Whats the trendiness all about.  Makes no sense.  Do people feel they "earned" the baby and love it more?  I'll never quite get it!  

 

Hum I'd really like to see CT in IMAX 3d. Maybe at Lincoln sq theater  

JM1977

Mrs.McIrish:

Edwina.McDunnough:

Saying that all pain is equal is condescending. I completely understand that there are levels of grief that I have not experienced and I know that experiences I have suffered through seem light compared to others. I also look back at my own very painful IVF failures and think they were a piece of cake compared to my DE failures (lesson: there's always more). It seems like the people that are the most defensive of their suffering are the ones that have suffered the least. Again, not to deny that they haven't suffered and not that their suffering isn't acute. However, certain experiences are profound and for someone who has not had these experiences to equate themselves to the other is belittling and insulting to say the least.

Big hugs. I think of you, Reb and Krod (and Hollymichael even though she doesn't know me) all the time when I'm feeling sorry for myself. You are sadly correct that there can always be more and bigger failures which just plain sucks.

This is me, too.  My heart just goes out to all of you.  DE is supposed to be an answer after years of pain, and when it isn't, it's almost unbearable.  My heart hurts for everyone on this long and painful path of losses, multiple cycles, and heartbreak. (((HUGS))) 

jlcrane78

Mrs.McIrish:

I have been thinking a lot about "where do I go from here". The reality is that not everyone makes it to the other side. Where do they go after treatment? Disappear like they don't exist? People don't want to talk about those people. In about 72 hrs, that will be my reality and I have no clue. This will be lifetime pain that is just different from someone who did one IVF and it worked.

This is my new dilemma. It appears my pregnancy is no longer viable, and this was our last shot.  So while vets will always be a home board to me, I still feel as if I won't quite belong once we have nothing left to hope for.  I don't think I belong on child free: not by choice because we will continue to try naturally (even though that hasn't worked once for us in our 6 years of trying).  I have thought about backing away completely. 

Mrs.McIrish

jlcrane78:

Mrs.McIrish:

I have been thinking a lot about "where do I go from here". The reality is that not everyone makes it to the other side. Where do they go after treatment? Disappear like they don't exist? People don't want to talk about those people. In about 72 hrs, that will be my reality and I have no clue. This will be lifetime pain that is just different from someone who did one IVF and it worked.

This is my new dilemma. It appears my pregnancy is no longer viable, and this was our last shot.  So while vets will always be a home board to me, I still feel as if I won't quite belong once we have nothing left to hope for.  I don't think I belong on child free: not by choice because we will continue to try naturally (even though that hasn't worked once for us in our 6 years of trying).  I have thought about backing away completely. 

Oh sweetie, this is just awful. I just went down and read your update in PurpleIris' post to you.  There are no words.  I am so sorry.

SweetDahlia

I am too upset to make any sense I am sure. But you know I just don't get the people who get pregnant t and still want to tell everyone how IF they are/were. We all have pain, but if I have to hear one more f-ing time how it took my sister 3 G-D cycle of clomid to have her baby I may have to just kill someone. I mean so sad she thinks she "might" have issues again. OMG it might take her more than 3 months this time, but I still have no baby and have had two losses and my family thinks she is the one who needs all the love and attetion and money. I mean she has one baby and they feel bad she can't have a 2nd yet we have none, but now she knows the pain sice she has one and just has to have another one. it's BS.

I can't stand when people come to this board and tell us how IF they are and get pregnant on their 2nd IVF and them complain they only got 20 embies and omg only 11 made it to freeze. we didn't even get 1 good embie and this girl was made she had 9 or 11 to freeze. Or I will never have kids after our 1 failed IVF and bam they are pregnant. I guess that just makes me bitter. But they never belonged here in the first place.

Women who go to an IF board and even a PAIF board to say how they were IF and now are pregnant and don't want the baby are AWs who just make everyone else feel bad. They do it to make people mad and sad. If that girl didn't want a 2nd baby she should have been on the pill. I just hope that baby will be loved, but you know F her and her stupid husband.

illinigal

Edwina.McDunnough:

Saying that all pain is equal is condescending. I completely understand that there are levels of grief that I have not experienced and I know that experiences I have suffered through seem light compared to others. I also look back at my own very painful IVF failures and think they were a piece of cake compared to my DE failures (lesson: there's always more). It seems like the people that are the most defensive of their suffering are the ones that have suffered the least. Again, not to deny that they haven't suffered and not that their suffering isn't acute. However, certain experiences are profound and for someone who has not had these experiences to equate themselves to the other is belittling and insulting to say the least.

I agree, except for the DE part as I've never experienced that.   But I definitely know how hard a DE failure would be given these eggs are supposed to be better than your own eggs.

I don't want any of us to be here, but I'm so glad to have met you ladies to comiserate with.  I generally feel happy for those that had success on IVF 1 and those that never experienced a loss.   They will never know what it's like for us that have, but I don't wish that pain on anyone.  Sometimes I'm bitter, but I try not to let it rule me.  We are planning to try IVF again so it's easy for me to remain hopeful.  I dread the day we can't do medical treatments anyone because I don't think I can ever except that it is over and we can't have more kids.

Group hug. 

AmCheri

I second the group hug. 

rockpaperlove

AmCheri:

I second the group hug. 

I could def use a group hug.

My thoughts and well wishes go out to each of you.  

((hugs))

hollymichael

Mrs.McIrish:

I have been thinking a lot about "where do I go from here". The reality is that not everyone makes it to the other side. Where do they go after treatment? Disappear like they don't exist? People don't want to talk about those people. In about 72 hrs, that will be my reality and I have no clue. This will be lifetime pain that is just different from someone who did one IVF and it worked.

I do "know" you as I still lurk here even though it probably isn't good for me. I really hope you are mistaken and make it to the other side. If you don't, I wanted to say that a year after giving up, I feel pretty good. I still have a dark day or two (like yesterday when I ran into a 41 year old pregnant woman I know), but most of the time I am doing ok. So, I am still around and life does go on. I am just taking a different path than the one I had hoped to take. But most of the time, I am pretty happy with this path too which for us involves a lot of travel!

I hope it was ok to post. I really hope that you get a nice surprise in a few days. But if you don't, and need any support, page me on this board.

Roxie5739

Mrs.McIrish:

I have been thinking a lot about "where do I go from here". The reality is that not everyone makes it to the other side. Where do they go after treatment? Disappear like they don't exist? People don't want to talk about those people. In about 72 hrs, that will be my reality and I have no clue. This will be lifetime pain that is just different from someone who did one IVF and it worked.

I know that I said that I needed to move on, yet  find I that I lurk here more and more each day.

McIrish - I truly hope that you get a nice surprise in a few days. I have everything crossed for you.

I am 10 days into this CFNBC journey and each day my emotions change and it is still an every thought consuming period for me. I found that I did not make it to the other side, yet hope each day that something will change for us to happen but if not, the plan to readjust will be a long and arduous journey. I know that I will have differ pent pains to others, men are no more important or painful, we all experience great disappointments in life. I can only hope from here that I find something in life that will blunt the pain for me and allow me to take a step away from IF each day.

to you all and it just sucks that we even have to go through any of this c.rap! 

Mitzi Bishi

Thank you for posting this. It really resonates with me. I wish there were more terms for things as opposed to simply the "infertility" umbrella. I'm always baffled by the fact that people "only" needed clomid are put into the same category as someone who's gone through multiple rounds of IVF, donor anything, or been confronted with these issues. Beginning at the very end or not even having that option are very humbling, but unfortunately people can't wrap their minds around things unless they are knee deep in it. 

The point is no one wants their feeling negated and no one should trivialize what someone else goes through. 

IF is truly one of the only things that I can think of that no matter how hard you work towards it there can be constant treading water and sadly not everyone makes it to shore.  

I think so often and perhaps because I fear / likely could become a member of CFNBC that these women just wilt into oblivion, which is absolutely awful. No one wants to be around the person who society thinks is "strange" for not being a mother, so they avoid them. There truly aren't enough resources for those who want and are left empty handed. Others don't know how to handle their grieving, which makes it only more isolating for these couples in a baby-centric world. 

So many people will say being a parent is their life defining moment, and for many I'm certain it is, but life should be lived regardless. I always say that having a baby is like winning the lottery. It's not going to make you happy if you're not already happy and at the end of it all the only "guarantee" is that you're going to be living your life. 

(preaching to the choir) I hate, with a fiery rage, when people say family is the most important thing, the world is already overpopulated, or whatever other clich? and the on the other side judge and belittle those who have suffered with IF when chances are 99% they've had children themselves.