TY & Unfertilized Eggs Update

tgrbelle

Last Friday I posted about our IVF failing due to unfertilized eggs and the devestation & confusion we felt.  First let me thank each and every one of you that posted from the very bottom of my heart.  All of the well wishes and advice truly touched me and made our situation much easier to deal with.  So thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!!

Yesterday we were able to talk with the RE and find out exactly what happended and why.  Out of the 18 eggs retreived, I actually had 13 that fertilized - but they were what she calls "delayed fertilization" and would never make it any further.  Those 13 were graded well (MII), but the other 5 were the worst grade (DV) and never fertilized.  Although 13 were graded well, the fact that 5 were horrible indicates I have poor egg quality.

The RE said I did not have PCOS, but wants to treat me as though I do since I have the egg quality of a PCOS patient.  For the next IVF round I'll take metformin a month before, she'll use the antagonist protocol, & let me go a day later.  If that doesn't work, we'll have to use donor eggs.  We've also decided to hold off on IVF#2 until DH returns from deployment so I can give my body a break and have him with me for support.  We're also getting a 2nd and possibly 3rd opinion.  Our insurance will probably cap out on IVF#2, so we want to make sure that her new protocol is more than just a test.

Has anyone had poor egg quality improved with a change in protocol?  Has anyone used or considered using an egg donor?  If so, any thoughts or tips about egg donation?  Thank you again for all the support!

epphd

Wow - Well, it sounds like you got some good info, but I will be honest - having 5 poor eggs does NOT sounds like an indicator of "bad eggs."  Having 5/18 eggs not behave well sounds pretty darn good actually.  Even in perfectly fertile women, about 50% of eggs suck. It's how the female reproductive system works. 

I don't know what to say about the delayed fertilization, except that it sounds like you should definitely be using ICSI if you are not already.  If the quality of those that did fertilize was good, then I think you should be very much heartened.

Like you, I had PCOS tendencies without the diagnosis.  I produced as many as 30+ eggs on low dose stims, and while our fert rate was always around 65% (low-ish end of normal), we really never had any embies survive past day 3.  We tried IVF with my eggs 4 times before moving to donor eggs. 

At three clinics we were told that it could be my eggs, it could be his sperm, it could be some intrinsic feature of embryos made from his sperm/my eggs.  In short, there was nothing overt to suggest that yes, I have "bad eggs."  No biochemical or homonal metrics, lots of eggs and easy stims - on paper I should have great eggs.  But it is TRULY uncommon to stim well, get lots of eggs, and just have "bad eggs," so I would urge you to try your doc's suggestion, and if you don't have much better luck, try a new clinic. Or, as you said, get a second opionion now - it certainly can't hurt.

As much as I am a proponent of donor eggs, I do think many docs suggest it way too prematurely because they know the success rates are good.  I think you have lots of things to try and tests to run before a diagnosis of poor egg quality is made.

As for metformin, it made no difference for me, but I do know lots of women for whom it has been a magic bullet. It's certainly worth trying.

Test wise, see about getting both of yourselves karyotyped to look for chromosomal problems; look into SCSA testing (sperm chromatin analysis) and have your AMA and inhibin-B levels checked. These can be indicators of egg quality. 

GL and don't get discouraged just yet.  Hang in there and advocate for yourself

njdcgirl

Don't have any answers to your questions, but there are several girls on here, and SAIF who have used donor eggs. 

Just wanted to say that I am glad you got some information from your RE.  I'm sure it doesn't make it any easier, but the fact that you have a plan is a good thing!

Nerwak

I'm glad you got some information about what happened and have a new plan for next time. I can't help with anything, but I hope next time works out for you. GL!!!

krissyh21

I have to agree with Elizabeth 100%, I have nothing more to add just wanted to wish you luck

Tarahville

epphd:

Wow - Well, it sounds like you got some good info, but I will be honest - having 5 poor eggs does NOT sounds like an indicator of "bad eggs."  Having 5/18 eggs not behave well sounds pretty darn good actually.  Even in perfectly fertile women, about 50% of eggs suck. It's how the female reproductive system works. 

I don't know what to say about the delayed fertilization, except that it sounds like you should definitely be using ICSI if you are not already.  If the quality of those that did fertilize was good, then I think you should be very much heartened.

Like you, I had PCOS tendencies without the diagnosis.  I produced as many as 30+ eggs on low dose stims, and while our fert rate was always around 65% (low-ish end of normal), we really never had any embies survive past day 3.  We tried IVF with my eggs 4 times before moving to donor eggs. 

At three clinics we were told that it could be my eggs, it could be his sperm, it could be some intrinsic feature of embryos made from his sperm/my eggs.  In short, there was nothing overt to suggest that yes, I have "bad eggs."  No biochemical or homonal metrics, lots of eggs and easy stims - on paper I should have great eggs.  But it is TRULY uncommon to stim well, get lots of eggs, and just have "bad eggs," so I would urge you to try your doc's suggestion, and if you don't have much better luck, try a new clinic. Or, as you said, get a second opionion now - it certainly can't hurt.

As much as I am a proponent of donor eggs, I do think many docs suggest it way too prematurely because they know the success rates are good.  I think you have lots of things to try and tests to run before a diagnosis of poor egg quality is made.

As for metformin, it made no difference for me, but I do know lots of women for whom it has been a magic bullet. It's certainly worth trying.

Test wise, see about getting both of yourselves karyotyped to look for chromosomal problems; look into SCSA testing (sperm chromatin analysis) and have your AMA and inhibin-B levels checked. These can be indicators of egg quality. 

GL and don't get discouraged just yet.  Hang in there and advocate for yourself

I don't have anything more to add either, but wanted to wish you luck. ((hugs))