I've seen both extremes of the harassment in the workplace side through my husband's job. One extreme being anything goes, the other being even having family photos in the office was a no-no because someone might consider that family beach photo or your kid's gymnastics photo sexually harassing. There's a happy middle somewhere.
@sandbar517@pandakov SANE nurses are amazing. It’s intense work, but so very needed! I worked in the ER as a social worker for years and really appreciate the SANE nurses! I mostly had to be involved for children and that absolutely sucked, but again, so important! Good for you!
I was much more impressed with our local advocacy group we have here. Completely volunteer services, people come to the ER at all hours and stay the entire time with the patients, and then continue along with them through the entire medical and legal process. Such an amazing service, and it was so extremely helpful for them to have someone with them since the "nursing" care part of SANE suffers while you're trying to focus on evidence collection.
Me, 35 Hubs, 32 Married June 2012 BFP June 2013- blighted ovum, D&C Aug 2013 BFP Oct 2013- twins! A&H born May 2014 BFP Aug 2017- EDD 5/8/17
@pandakov I got trained in 2013, but left the ER in 2015, so I didn't do it for very long. And I was only trained (not certified) for adults-I don't think I could handle doing the pediatric exams, especially after having kids.
Yeah. I see/deal with a lot of not great things anyway just due to the nature of the unit I’m on. You definetly have to do a lot of compartmentalization.
@pandakov Oh, I'm sure. I was glad when I moved here because when I worked in Iowa we were one of the only/biggest hospitals in the area, so we got all the traumas, children included. When I moved here, the hospitals are so specialized, we almost never saw kids in the ER because they all came here to Children's. I'm in research at Children's Hospital now, so I don't see the same level of stuff, but seeing all the kids in the hospital still makes me really sad. And I work in genetics, so it's still hard to see these kids with rare genetic diseases, some with very short life expectancy.
Me, 35 Hubs, 32 Married June 2012 BFP June 2013- blighted ovum, D&C Aug 2013 BFP Oct 2013- twins! A&H born May 2014 BFP Aug 2017- EDD 5/8/17
@pandakov Oh, I'm sure. I was glad when I moved here because when I worked in Iowa we were one of the only/biggest hospitals in the area, so we got all the traumas, children included. When I moved here, the hospitals are so specialized, we almost never saw kids in the ER because they all came here to Children's. I'm in research at Children's Hospital now, so I don't see the same level of stuff, but seeing all the kids in the hospital still makes me really sad. And I work in genetics, so it's still hard to see these kids with rare genetic diseases, some with very short life expectancy.
Yes. That would be very hard. I will say the one good thing about being on a trauma unit is, for the most part, the kids on our floor are HEALTHY they’re just suffering from injuries that most of them (hopefully) will eventually recover from.
It it would be very difficult (for me) working with terminal kiddos suffering from genetic disorders - I don’t know that I could do hem/onc either.
If my husband was to flirt/touch or watch a woman be naked and pay for it in any situation outside of a strip club I WOULD LOOSE MY MIND SO DAMN FAST... so I don’t see how walking through some doors changes that? I’m 100% not okay with it but my h also isn’t really interested in it.. he said he stopped being a funny thing pretty quick. I also just think it’s so horrible to sit there and openly judge woman and see them just as sexual objects. I’m all for owning your sexuality and feeling strong in whatever way that takes shape for you, but is this really where we’re still at? We really think this is respectable? Do you want your daughters to grow up wanting that life?
ETA not you as in YOU but more of a collective you. No pojnting fingers just more of a thought.
If my husband was to flirt/touch or watch a woman be naked and pay for it in any situation outside of a strip club I WOULD LOOSE MY MIND SO DAMN FAST... so I don’t see how walking through some doors changes that? I’m 100% not okay with it but my h also isn’t really interested in it.. he said he stopped being a funny thing pretty quick. I also just think it’s so horrible to sit there and openly judge woman and see them just as sexual objects. I’m all for owning your sexuality and feeling strong in whatever way that takes shape for you, but is this really where we’re still at? We really think this is respectable? Do you want your daughters to grow up wanting that life?
I want my hypothetical daughter to grow up and respect herself regardless of what she displays to other people. Those two things are NOT mutually exclusive. It’s baffling to me that this went from a conversation about “how do you feel about your spouse doing X or Y?” To “Let’s shame the women who do this!” Smh
@ivyvines6 I’m not shaming women. I’m very clearly saying that i don’t think it’s acceptable to be judging and treating them like sexual objects. I don’t think any part of the situation is respectable if that’s the word that’s being used but it’s not just woman doing it-it’s the way men think that by paying for this they have power to treat women how they want.
@ivyvines6 I’m not shaming women. I’m very clearly saying that i don’t think it’s acceptable to be judging and treating them like sexual objects. I don’t think any part of the situation is respectable if that’s the word that’s being used but it’s not just woman doing it-it’s the way men think that by paying for this they have power to treat women how they want.
You’re entitled to your opinion about the subject, but your initial choice of wording has severely rubbed me the wrong way. By asking “Do you want your daughters to grow up to want that life?” You’re implying there is something wrong with a woman being comfortable with her sexuality, whether you turn that around to be about men after the fact or not.
The thing is I can’t tell if your specifically discussing strip clubs, or pornography, or if you're referring to both. I don’t have a lot to say about strip clubs having never worked within one, or visited one, and only have known a couple strippers. We can discuss just how respectable pornography is, though I’m not getting the vibe you’re up for hearing a view that’s different than your own.
@ivyvines6 I didn’t think i was putting out the vibe I wasn’t interested in your opinion? You posted know this would have different sides and this is mine, that’s okay. I don’t expect to agree- this is just the way I see it. But also, like I said, I’m all for women owning their sexuality however they want and what shape that takes. I (as in ME) just don’t see this as something that I want my husband/myself/ or my children(sons or daughters) to see as a way to treat people or be treated.
@mamabird515 I’m so happy we’re going to be friends after these kids are born.
Ftr every other person who responded to this UO didn’t turn it around to be about anything other than a preference or opinion. You went and added the extra level of shaming to it. News flash: you don’t get to decided how your children are “treated” as adults and the sooner you let go of that fantasy the better. Namaste
@silverhope come now... there hasn’t been any cussing or name-calling or anything of that manner... people can have strong differences of opinion and banter about it without it being drama.
@ivyvines6 your comments were right on. I definitely took @mamabird8 comments as judgy as hell, with a sprinkling of shaming. To say “I’m all for women owning their sexuality” and then “do you really want your daughters to grow up that way” is like, pure hypocrisy.
@mamabird515 yes. You're implying that someone's attendance at a strip club determines if one's daughter is a stripper (which also implies strippers are demeaned women who are less of people).
The two strippers I've known were not forced to do it and loved the money they made (which is more than I make as a professional) and they're good people.
I’m not saying strippers are bad people or anyone in that sort of industry at all! That doesn’t mean I want to support it or want my kids going into that life.
My experience: after my parents divorced, the only women I saw my dad date was a stripper. She was unhealthy, did horrible drugs and got caught up in some really bad situations. She was sweet and kind and I remember having fun with her- but her profession kept her in a really bad cycle that my dad tried to help her break, unsuccessfully. I don’t know all the circumstances or what the truths were at that time but, my experience with her was that this wasn’t a life that allowed her to live the best life for her. It’s not all rainbows and sparkles.... or glitter
@mamabird515 No job is rainbows and sparkles. I also bet you a lot of money if your dad's girlfriend hadn't been a stripper, she still would have been using drugs. I am sorry that you had a negative experience in your childhood, though.
@ivyvines6 it seems like you’re looking for something wrong with everything I’m saying. I actually said good things about her and never mentioned not liking her. You’re generalizing to fit the narrative you want me to have. I’m not looking to change anyone’s opinion on this.. I was posting mine, since it’s clearly unpopular- I guess it fits the thread. At the end of the day, I’m sorry if youre offended by how i worded things and it rubbed you the wrong way, it wasn’t the intention I had.
Let's not pretend that anyone on this board is hoping their kid grows up to be a stripper. And it has nothing to do with how nice a stripper might be or how much money she might make. By definition, it's a job where a woman is not respected and is objectified. In many, many cases, the women are not there by choice. AFAIK, in Montreal, a majority of them are the victims of human trafficking. Many of them end up on drugs so that they can't really get out of the profession. There are some who are there by choice, but it's not the norm.
Yes, women can and should own our sexuality. Let's not pretend that selling your body means you own your sexuality.
If the discussion is about whether you or your partner are turned on by strippers or porn, fine. I imagine that almost everyone is turned on by seeing naked people. That doesn't make the industry ok. Do some research on the effects of porn and violence towards women. At a bare minimum, listen to some of Chris Rock's stand-up.
Let's not pretend that anyone on this board is hoping their kid grows up to be a stripper. And it has nothing to do with how nice a stripper might be or how much money she might make. By definition, it's a job where a woman is not respected and is objectified. In many, many cases, the women are not there by choice. AFAIK, in Montreal, a majority of them are the victims of human trafficking. Many of them end up on drugs so that they can't really get out of the profession. There are some who are there by choice, but it's not the norm.
Yes, women can and should own our sexuality. Let's not pretend that selling your body means you own your sexuality.
If the discussion is about whether you or your partner are turned on by strippers or porn, fine. I imagine that almost everyone is turned on by seeing naked people. That doesn't make the industry ok. Do some research on the effects of porn and violence towards women. At a bare minimum, listen to some of Chris Rock's stand-up.
I have to admit that my experience with strip clubs is in smaller areas, living in the midwest. I've only known two strippers who were there by choice and they never spoke to me about human trafficking. I wanted to research a bit before answering this and the only articles I could get on human trafficking in the United States for strip clubs were for Miami. I also came across two articles where strip clubs are banning together to fight human trafficking.
I want to skip over that for now and just focus on your statement selling your body doesn't mean you own your sexuality. I completely disagree, if it's done not out of force. That is actually your power you're holding over someone. Honestly, I believe prostitution should be legal if it could be government regulated and safer. I've always said I'd be a stripper if I was skinnier. The experience I've had with strip clubs the women were protected from assault. Think of it this way, people are stupid enough to throw money at naked women and they're capitalizing oh it. That sounds pretty owning their sexuality to me.
It really sounds like this argument is turning from "what do I think about my spouse doing this" to "strippers are demeaned and strip clubs are bad".
@nanifrog Actually, I have said on many occasions that if my daughter decides she wants to be a sex worker, I'm okay with that. Professional Dominatrix? I'm down. Work at a legal prostitution house like the Bunny Ranch? Cool, too. She wants to strip or sell her used panties online or do webcam service or any of the other myriad of ways she can do sex work....all fine, too.
My hope is that she would take precautions to protect herself. That she would be well educated about the risks and rewards of the job before jumping in. And that she would have an exit strategy just like she would for any other job she decided upon for her life.
Thing is, I don't own my child. I don't own her sexuality, orientation, mind, identity, or her vagina. I don't get to make the decision for her when and how she uses any of those in her life. I do, however, get to be her support system. I do get to play devil's advocate with her so she can make educated decisions. And I do get to choose to support her in all she endeavors to accomplish.
No pretending needed here. I'd be happy to have my daughter working the pole if that's what she wants for her life. There is no shame in choosing sex work for your own life.
Sincerely, retired sex worker who wasn't a stripper
Re: UO Thursday 11/30
Married June 2012
BFP June 2013- blighted ovum, D&C Aug 2013
BFP Oct 2013- twins! A&H born May 2014
BFP Aug 2017- EDD 5/8/17
Married June 2012
BFP June 2013- blighted ovum, D&C Aug 2013
BFP Oct 2013- twins! A&H born May 2014
BFP Aug 2017- EDD 5/8/17
It it would be very difficult (for me) working with terminal kiddos suffering from genetic disorders - I don’t know that I could do hem/onc either.
I also just think it’s so horrible to sit there and openly judge woman and see them just as sexual objects. I’m all for owning your sexuality and feeling strong in whatever way that takes shape for you, but is this really where we’re still at? We really think this is respectable? Do you want your daughters to grow up wanting that life?
ETA not you as in YOU but more of a collective you. No pojnting fingers just more of a thought.
The thing is I can’t tell if your specifically discussing strip clubs, or pornography, or if you're referring to both. I don’t have a lot to say about strip clubs having never worked within one, or visited one, and only have known a couple strippers. We can discuss just how respectable pornography is, though I’m not getting the vibe you’re up for hearing a view that’s different than your own.
Ftr every other person who responded to this UO didn’t turn it around to be about anything other than a preference or opinion. You went and added the extra level of shaming to it. News flash: you don’t get to decided how your children are “treated” as adults and the sooner you let go of that fantasy the better. Namaste
See? Sarcasm works.
Your need to insert yourself in something that was done was obnoxious and just added to the drama.
(Not trying to diminish anyone’s feelings btw)
Married: 8/22/15
BFP #1: 8/22/17 | DS: 4/20/18
BFP #2: 7/14/19 | EDD: 3/18/20
Married: 8/22/15
BFP #1: 8/22/17 | DS: 4/20/18
BFP #2: 7/14/19 | EDD: 3/18/20
The two strippers I've known were not forced to do it and loved the money they made (which is more than I make as a professional) and they're good people.
My experience: after my parents divorced, the only women I saw my dad date was a stripper. She was unhealthy, did horrible drugs and got caught up in some really bad situations. She was sweet and kind and I remember having fun with her- but her profession kept her in a really bad cycle that my dad tried to help her break, unsuccessfully. I don’t know all the circumstances or what the truths were at that time but, my experience with her was that this wasn’t a life that allowed her to live the best life for her. It’s not all rainbows and sparkles.... or glitter
Yes, women can and should own our sexuality. Let's not pretend that selling your body means you own your sexuality.
If the discussion is about whether you or your partner are turned on by strippers or porn, fine. I imagine that almost everyone is turned on by seeing naked people. That doesn't make the industry ok. Do some research on the effects of porn and violence towards women. At a bare minimum, listen to some of Chris Rock's stand-up.
I want to skip over that for now and just focus on your statement selling your body doesn't mean you own your sexuality. I completely disagree, if it's done not out of force. That is actually your power you're holding over someone. Honestly, I believe prostitution should be legal if it could be government regulated and safer. I've always said I'd be a stripper if I was skinnier. The experience I've had with strip clubs the women were protected from assault. Think of it this way, people are stupid enough to throw money at naked women and they're capitalizing oh it. That sounds pretty owning their sexuality to me.
It really sounds like this argument is turning from "what do I think about my spouse doing this" to "strippers are demeaned and strip clubs are bad".
@nanifrog Actually, I have said on many occasions that if my daughter decides she wants to be a sex worker, I'm okay with that. Professional Dominatrix? I'm down. Work at a legal prostitution house like the Bunny Ranch? Cool, too. She wants to strip or sell her used panties online or do webcam service or any of the other myriad of ways she can do sex work....all fine, too.
My hope is that she would take precautions to protect herself. That she would be well educated about the risks and rewards of the job before jumping in. And that she would have an exit strategy just like she would for any other job she decided upon for her life.
Thing is, I don't own my child. I don't own her sexuality, orientation, mind, identity, or her vagina. I don't get to make the decision for her when and how she uses any of those in her life. I do, however, get to be her support system. I do get to play devil's advocate with her so she can make educated decisions. And I do get to choose to support her in all she endeavors to accomplish.
No pretending needed here. I'd be happy to have my daughter working the pole if that's what she wants for her life. There is no shame in choosing sex work for your own life.
Sincerely, retired sex worker who wasn't a stripper