Comfort Eating vs Actually Hungry - MOTN

Ljohn43

ok - so we are trying to do sleep training, but we are having a hard time determining whether Graham is actually really hungry in the MOTN or if he's just in the habit of eating and that's why he's crying? If he's just in the habit of eating, then I guess I'm okay with letting him CIO a bit, but if he's actually really hungry then I think that's cruel to withhold food. Both my dr and his pedi have said that it's okay to let him cry during MOTN bc he is gaining weight appropriately, but it's still so hard for me. Any thoughts on how to tell whether he is actually hungry? 

TL;DR: how do you tell if your baby is hungry or just conditioned to feed in the MOTN? 

Thanks!! 

nackie

I have the same problem, I figure he can't really be hungry every two hours, but it's so hard to tell

Ljohn43

I know! I always end up feeding him and thinking "ok, after this feeding he will finally be full and sleep the rest of the night" - nope, he's up 2-4 hrs later I tend to think he isn't actually hungry, but I just don't know. 

cali1710

I'm in the same position. I'm pretty positive shes habit eating. Ive been slowly decreasing the amount we feed her. Last night we gave her 2 ounces and I know the second ounce she was just drinking to suck. 

teachmegs817

Ljohn43 said:

I know! I always end up feeding him and thinking "ok, after this feeding he will finally be full and sleep the rest of the night" - nope, he's up 2-4 hrs later I tend to think he isn't actually hungry, but I just don't know. 

This is how we determined that Griffin wasn't really hungry, but just comfort feeding.  Do you bf or bottle feed?  We started to decrease the amount he was getting at night by 1oz. He was getting 4.5-5 oz bottles during the day, when we were still doing MOTN feedings.  We would only give him 3.5-4. and then eventually only 3 at night.  It was a way for him to start associating that these bottle feedings weren't really a true feeding at all, more just a snack.  We had done this method starting at 3 months, up until he kicked the MOTN feeding at 4 1/2 months.  So it took us a while.  

At around 4 months, he would wake up, we'd feed him like usual, but instead of going back down for the rest of the night, he'd be up again within 2-3 hours.  We began just soothing him with his paci. and patting him, to see if he'd go right back to sleep. Thinking that maybe he was just comfort eating, versus really being hungry.  Within 3 weeks, he was done all together with the night feeding.  He hasn't had a bottle at night since the last week of April. Yes, I remember the time frame because it was GLORIOUS for us to not be waking up for that whole process anymore, lol. 

Ljohn43

Oh that sounds amazing! We had a 2 week stage right before he hit 4 months where he slept 9-11 hrs per night and we thought we were home free!! 

I bf but on nights my husband is on duty he feeds him pumped milk. It's hard to reduce amt with bf'ing, but we can def try that when my husband feeds him and I can try to shorten my bf feedings. Thanks! 

klbh

@Ljohn43 we just tried soothing LO with a pacifier and rocking when he woke in the night. If that didn't work within a minute (or if he woke again within less than an hour) I'd nurse him. After a couple of weeks of that, plus extra feeding during the day (in a quiet, distraction-free area!) he started to go 6-8 hours pretty consistently without waking to eat, knock on wood! 

I feel like often my little guy would happily accept a snack but doesn't need one to sustain his health--much like me! but if he's starving, he definitely lets us know! 

fishee333

Before sleep training, I figured out that LO consistently liked to eat at around 2AM because when she woke up at night, I would give her a binky. When she wasn't hungry, the binky would settle her, and when she was hungry, she didn't want the binky, and she ate a ton when nursing. I also used to feed her at 5AM, then at 8AM, but she stopped wanting to eat at 8, so I skipped the 5AM one and now she happily eats at 8 and throughout the day every 3 hours. So complicated! But now that we have a set eating schedule I don't have to worry about feeding her at her non scheduled time, and she knows the schedule now too. 

MissMheMhe

I've started offering LO his paci when he wakes motn. Usually he wants to suck and the paci is enough. He really only uses when falling asleep. Some nights are better than others, though. Rarely does he wake me up more thank once, occasionally he will wake me 30 minutes before my alarm.

failuretofly

I keep having this dilemma with DS. He was consistently eating 2x/night usually around 1 & 4, and taking a decent amount. I think he's outgrown that second night feed though but it has become a habit. I've tried just giving him is soother and rocking him back to sleep, and sometimes it works, but hes usually up again within 1/2 an hour. But if I feed him, then he barely takes anything and then takes very little when he wakes at 7, then is starved by his next feed at 10am. I want to break the second feed habit, but i don't know how to go about it. I don't know if I should try to push back the earlier feed, or just try to eliminate the later feed all together. I dont think I could tolerate a night of getting up every 1/2 hour from 4-7. 

ETA he also gets really excited when he sees DH or I (he likes us, what can i say ) so he gets all jacked up and then it's even harder for him to get back to sleep. But he can't get back to sleep without his soother, and he isn't able to get it back in by himself. 

cali1710

@kvacmak we have the same problem! She gets excited when we come in the room and it makes it hard to get her back down. And she also cant fall asleep on her own yet. Ugh! Ha. But its so cute. She melts my heart when she gets excited

Ljohn43

@kvacmak my dr told me that he should be capable of going 6 hours without feeding in the middle of the night. She suggested to feed him milk the first feeding that he wakes up (usually between 1030-1) and then feed him 3-4 oz (no more than 4 in 24 hrs) of water when he wakes up for the 2nd feeding. I've tried it - he's not too thrilled ab the water - I have to warm it up. But he eventually goes back to sleep for a few hours after that (sometimes it takes 1-2 hrs to get him back down though). She said if we do that consistently for a week he should eliminate that feeding. I guess we'll see. 

cali1710

@Ljohn43 funny you say that, I gave my LO a tiny bit of water when she woke up at 4 am and she went back to sleep. Maybe she just needed to wet her whistle. But it also takes about 2 hours to get her back down when she wakes between 1030&12.  What the heck!

failuretofly

kvacmak said:ï

I keep having this dilemma with DS. He was consistently eating 2x/night usually around 1 & 4, and taking a decent amount. I think he's outgrown that second night feed though but it has become a habit. I've tried just giving him is soother and rocking him back to sleep, and sometimes it works, but hes usually up again within 1/2 an hour. But if I feed him, then he barely takes anything and then takes very little when he wakes at 7, then is starved by his next feed at 10am. I want to break the second feed habit, but i don't know how to go about it. I don't know if I should try to push back the earlier feed, or just try to eliminate the later feed all together. I dont think I could tolerate a night of getting up every 1/2 hour from 4-7. 

ETA he also gets really excited when he sees DH or I (he likes us, what can i say ) so he gets all jacked up and then it's even harder for him to get back to sleep. But he can't get back to sleep without his soother, and he isn't able to get it back in by himself. 

To update,  last night I made it my mission to push back his 1am feed, ended up getting up to give him his soother twice at 12 & 1, then he stayed down until 3:30,  I fed him, then he went back to sleep until 7:30! Hopefully this is the start of a new trend and not a one off!

brideofgrace

I feed my 5 month old daughter between 4 and 5  full six oz bottles per day, with her last feeding being about an hour or two before bed. She usually sleeps between 9 and 10 hours every night, with no feedings until she gets up in the morning.  She also takes 2 solid naps every day.  Perhaps if you moms who are only bottle feeding around 4 oz each time increased the amount for each feeding by an oz or two, you would find your children don't require to be fed so much during the night? Just a thought. 

Cricket99

brideofgrace said:

I feed my 5 month old daughter between 4 and 5  full six oz bottles per day, with her last feeding being about an hour or two before bed. She usually sleeps between 9 and 10 hours every night, with no feedings until she gets up in the morning.  She also takes 2 solid naps every day.  Perhaps if you moms who are only bottle feeding around 4 oz each time increased the amount for each feeding by an oz or two, you would find your children don't require to be fed so much during the night? Just a thought. 

Fair warning. As a first time poster in an established community that you have never participated in, it might be best to introduce yourself on a post before you go on giving advice to others based on how your baby sleeps fabulously on multiple threads. No offence if it isn't, but this smells of MUD and trolling. 

cali1710

I feed my LO 4-5 6-7oz bottles during the day. She still wakes up. 

Ljohn43

I have increased bottle size to 6 oz and so far he is sleeping a little better. I have also given him some rice cereal before bedtime so not sure which (or maybe both) is helping. 

Knottie84607381

@Cricket99 Wow, Queeen of the threads much? Maybe they don't post more often because of responses like yours. Since when is there a post quota before one becomes eligible to share their experiences and advice? So she has something that works for her, you shouldn't get defensive because your way is different.

I'm also trying to increase daily bottle volume to see if that helps baby sleep better! Im trying to cut out night feeding as well. She always wakes up around 3am. We will see how it goes! 

Cricket99

@knottie84607381 like I said, no offence if it wasn't trolling, but I have lurked quite a bit on other boards and seen several very similar posts from people that come in out of nowhere and start posting things that sound like innocently giving advice at first and quickly turn into giant drama. Just curious about someone who comes seemingly out of nowhere and starts posting a lot very quickly. No offence meant to @brideofgrace if it's innocent. I've just seen crazy stuff start happening really quickly before and I really like this community. 

ETA: also I said nothing about her methods. I'm very much into whatever works for you and your family is best. There is no perfect, or absolutely correct way to do things.

teachmegs817

Once we started increasing DS's bottle intake, he did start dropping MOTN feedings. We were doing 3, then it went to 2, for about 2 months and then 1 for a month or so. @Ljohn43 we used oatmeal 2x a day to help introduce solids as well as keeping him full. For some reason, oatmeal for us seemed like a better nutritional thing to be giving him than rice cereal. I never liked how the rice cereal came out. It just looked so cheap and pathetic, lol. Call me weird. He LOVES the oatmeal too.

Also, reading back on @brideofgrace 's posts. Her baby is asleep by midnight most nights with a bedtime routine starting at 9 p.m. No thanks. For some, that may work out fantastic, but if I had a potential 3 hour routine that was putting my child to bed by midnight and then I could finally go to bed myself after that, I'd rip my hair out. However, if that's what we ended up having to do for him, then so be it. I would certainly not create a routine of that though.

I get where @Cricket99 is coming from though. As pretty regular posters on here (not necessarily me, I don't get as much time anymore, but I have been apart of the Jan 16' board since finding out I was pregnant and had posted throughout my whole pregnancy), since day 1 on this board, you get taken back by someone who has never posted giving advice about a topic. Especially when yea, I looked back and every post she's had so far is how her baby has slept fabulously since day 1, pretty much. In that regard, I don't think you can even give sleeping advice to someone, because you've had a sleeping baby since the get go. 

Cricket99

@teachmegs817 that was said a little more eloquently than me and exactly what I meant. The words putting togethering and sentencing is hard as we are starting leap 5 and napping is becoming atrocious. 

teachmegs817

Cricket99 said:

@teachmegs817 that was said a little more eloquently than me and exactly what I meant. The words putting togethering and sentencing is hard as we are starting leap 5 and napping is becoming atrocious. 

Leap 5 has begun for us too. Sleeping hasn't really been too bad yet. We are also transitioning out of the Merlin suit and into the Zippadee. So I can understand it we've got some nights of rough sleep ahead of us. He is ALL over the crib, it's insane, lol. He sometimes gets himself out of the view from the camera, because he wiggles himself to the other end. The distance thing is becoming an issue. He is getting pretty fussy when someone leaves the room and isn't right there with him. Teething is another issue we are battling. 

JanuarysBaby1

I second what @cali1710 said. Still frequent night wakings regardless of how much she eats during the day. She can have a 8oz bottle and right as I'm dosing off I hear whining. I miss solid sleep. 

cali1710

JanuarysBaby1 said:

I second what @cali1710 said. Still frequent night wakings regardless of how much she eats during the day. She can have a 8oz bottle and right as I'm dosing off I hear whining. I miss solid sleep. 

Last night was horrendous. She was up at 945-1130. 130. Back up at 345 and isnt back yet (its almost 530).  Fml

JanuarysBaby1

cali1710 said:

JanuarysBaby1 said:

I second what @cali1710 said. Still frequent night wakings regardless of how much she eats during the day. She can have a 8oz bottle and right as I'm dosing off I hear whining. I miss solid sleep. 

Last night was horrendous. She was up at 945-1130. 130. Back up at 345 and isnt back yet (its almost 530).  Fml

Oh geez. I can't say I had a good night with LO. She was up every hour from 9pm until 2am but yours was way worse! So sorry! Maybe you can sneak in a nap today! 

cali1710

JanuarysBaby1 said:

cali1710 said:

JanuarysBaby1 said:

I second what @cali1710 said. Still frequent night wakings regardless of how much she eats during the day. She can have a 8oz bottle and right as I'm dosing off I hear whining. I miss solid sleep. 

Last night was horrendous. She was up at 945-1130. 130. Back up at 345 and isnt back yet (its almost 530).  Fml

Oh geez. I can't say I had a good night with LO. She was up every hour from 9pm until 2am but yours was way worse! So sorry! Maybe you can sneak in a nap today! 

She had a half hour nap at 7... But has been out for an hour right now. I hate how unpredictable naps are! Had I known this would be long I would have napped instead of tidying and getting dressed

teachmegs817

We've begun the frequent wakings again at night too.  Last night it started around 11:30. He was up anywhere from 1 hour, to 2 hours after that, pretty much the rest of the night. He would take maybe 3-5 minutes to get back to sleep, but DH and I were pretty much playing "tag, you're it!" All night/morning long. 

JanuarysBaby1

I had a rough night last night, up every 2 hours and it took a half hour to put her back to sleep. @teachmegs817 you're so lucky your DH alternates wakings with you! Ugh my DH just lays there like a lump on a log! Isn't it  supposed to get easier as they get older? I'm  starting the day off today with a migraine and exhaustion. Great. 

Ljohn43

@JanuarysBaby1 my husband and I take turns and alternate every night - you should suggest it! If you both work, it's only fair! If you stay at home, then I would suggest you taking all the weeknight nights and have him take fri & sat - that's what we did while I was on leave and it really helped us both stay sane! 

JanuarysBaby1

Ljohn43 said:

@JanuarysBaby1 my husband and I take turns and alternate every night - you should suggest it! If you both work, it's only fair! If you stay at home, then I would suggest you taking all the weeknight nights and have him take fri & sat - that's what we did while I was on leave and it really helped us both stay sane! 

In one ear out the other with him lol I only work 2 days a week but I still do the night wakings every single night since she's 2 weeks old. I suggested it many times but he's a "heavy sleeper" so I have to wake him to soothe the baby. But I may suggest it again cause this mama is tired! Thanks for the advice! 

nackie

JanuarysBaby1 said:

Ljohn43 said:

@JanuarysBaby1 my husband and I take turns and alternate every night - you should suggest it! If you both work, it's only fair! If you stay at home, then I would suggest you taking all the weeknight nights and have him take fri & sat - that's what we did while I was on leave and it really helped us both stay sane! 

In one ear out the other with him lol I only work 2 days a week but I still do the night wakings every single night since she's 2 weeks old. I suggested it many times but he's a "heavy sleeper" so I have to wake him to soothe the baby. But I may suggest it again cause this mama is tired! Thanks for the advice! 

I had the same problem with mine.  I ended up breaking down in tears one day last week and telling him I was miserable and couldn't keep doing what I was doing.  Things changed almost overnight and DH is super helpful now.  I had told him so many times that I needed help, but I don't think it really registered until then.

JanuarysBaby1

nackie said:

JanuarysBaby1 said:

Ljohn43 said:

@JanuarysBaby1 my husband and I take turns and alternate every night - you should suggest it! If you both work, it's only fair! If you stay at home, then I would suggest you taking all the weeknight nights and have him take fri & sat - that's what we did while I was on leave and it really helped us both stay sane! 

In one ear out the other with him lol I only work 2 days a week but I still do the night wakings every single night since she's 2 weeks old. I suggested it many times but he's a "heavy sleeper" so I have to wake him to soothe the baby. But I may suggest it again cause this mama is tired! Thanks for the advice! 

I had the same problem with mine.  I ended up breaking down in tears one day last week and telling him I was miserable and couldn't keep doing what I was doing.  Things changed almost overnight and DH is super helpful now.  I had told him so many times that I needed help, but I don't think it really registered until then.

I feel the same way. I feel like crying many of times and I feel like I'm always bitchy because I'm so exhausted. Usually if I suggest it, it'll turn into some sort of agrument. But it's catching up to me where I feel like I'm in a fog 24:7. My DH helps but just never with the nighttime, which is where I need help the most! 

nackie

@JanuarysBaby1 mine was also super helpful during the day, but did nothing at night.  He just figured that since I never slept well, that getting 3 hours or less a night for 5 months wasn't a big deal for me and with me EBF, it was easy for him to just say the baby was hungry every two hours when he woke up.  When I finally got through to him that I wasn't just complaining all those times I said I was so exhausted I was that didn't even feel human anymore he was willing to do whatever it took to help.  He read the entire book I got on sleep training and has implemented the plan almost all by himself.  All I have to do is get up and pump when I get too uncomfortable.  
I hope you're able to get some help from yours.