I am naturally drawn to Ben Carson... I like that he is a surgeon (and at the same time realize this has zero to do with one's ability to run a country). He seems to be down to earth, smart, and approachable which I like and I tend to agree with almost everything he says (or at least what I read on Facebook because I don't want to pretend I am political).
Because he walks to work and flies coach. And he's been talking about the same stuff for like 20 years.
If only his name wasn't Bernie. I just struggle with "President Bernie" We'll have to re-formalize the title for our least formal candidate. Last names only.
I think there should be minimum qualifications to be president, like any other job. It's more important than any other job, and all these people think they can do it without political experience. I find that ridiculous.
But I've said before, I no longer believe in democracy. I don't think the common voter, myself included, knows enough about the important topics of relevance to decide who is the best candidate. A more qualified panel than the average Murican should be selecting the president, from a qualified pool of applicants, IMHO. I'm ready for a perfect new political system that hasn't been designed yet. Maybe a J15 genius could get on that for me.
^^ for real. I'm not saying I'm a smart as hell cookie, by any means. But there are people out there that make me cringe that they will be voting. I wish I could trust a qualified group to appoint someone for us. But then I'm concerned about that group being bought off, and corruption. Maybe if we could develop a truth serum, we could administer it to all who aspire to be prez, then administer it also to the 'qualified group' that chooses the prez. They know the prez didn't lie to them, and we know the group didn't lie to us.
Sigh... Then we'd probably synthesize it and all buy it on the black market to administer to our husbands. 'Did you REALLY forget my birthday?'
Yes yes yes to what @virginiaunicorn11 said!!! My mom's boss (super involved in politics) kept asking me if my husband was going to vote and telling me to make him vote. (I'm not an American citizen yet so I can't vote) but I was just like, you don't WANT him to vote!! He doesn't KNOW anything and he'll just vote to vote!
It's so sad because it's such an important decision and like you said, the common voter just doesn't know enough.
I want to preface this that I do not feel like I am completely informed on all things politics. Ok, I tend to lean to the left on all things social, but struggle with the fiscal side. I also am team feel the Bern. Some of his ideals are a little too liberal for me, but his voting record is pretty consistent, and he doesn't seem to waver on his stances. That being said, this whole Isis thing has thrown me for a loop. I am all for helping people out, especially when there are children involved, but I can't help but fear for my own families safety. My husband travels to the city every day for work. I can't stand the thought of losing him because we opened our doors to help, but wound up letting terrorists in along the way. I know it's not as simple as that. I have many Syrian children that go to my school. They talk about the violence in their country, and how the U.S. has become a home where they feel safe. No child should have to live in fear, but again neither should I. Sooooo, long story short. I lean left, but worry about the open doors policy of the Democratic Party with the developments in terrorism.
I for one am never going to be ok with losing my right to vote and worry that some form of elected or "chosen" (even scarier) group of reps should never be given the right to make decisions for the country because eventually it would probably be a system of buying votes like we see to often with elected officials... Or the nepotism that is often seen on the local political scene... I think I downplay my ability to read and understand politics because I feel it keeps me at a safe distance from people who get heated in politics so I am sort of like "yeah I sort of like that guy" without getting into these massive political debates that have taken up residence on my fb newsfeed. I realize this may make me appear to be on of those uneducated voters and I need to stop doing that! Either way we all have a right to vote but people should try to make themselves more educated .... Funny example a family member was shocked when I told them I just don't vote down party lines lol.... I was like well each candidate matters in what they say and what their plans are lol
@cait7425 I understand what you are saying.... Although I have always voted Republican, for President, I find myself often in the middle of party lines... I am very liberal on many social issues but I can't get on board with the democrats' policy in many other issues and frankly the current administration seems so very anti-American. Like we are supposed to be ashamed to put our own families and citizens first.
^ exactly. It breaks my heart to see these families and innocent people in need. They are terrified, but when do you say enough is enough? We need to worry about our people at some point too. I wish there was a better way, but they can fingerprint and background check all they like. Many of the terrorist behind the Paris attacks had no criminal history. You know what actually makes me feel a little better? The fact that anonymous is on the hunt.
@cait7425 Yeah, why is the government not going after Isis like Anonymous is? Probably the fact he/she is not being employed by the government is why they're being successful, so I guess that's good they're not.
@ElRuby A lot of what you said is how I feel too. I've always voted Republican but it's because I side with most of their policies, not because I'm just voting to vote. If I agreed with a democrat candidate, I would vote for them. And yeah, I would feel very uncomfortable with the govt taking away my right to vote bc they think I'm not educated enough to make the right decision. I halfway think though that the person that "they" want in office gets in office anyway, despite votes..but I'm a slight conspiracy theorist which isn't healthy I know haha.
Im not sure who I'll cast a vote for yet, but I'm so sick of lying, bought out politicians who don't seem to care about what's best for our country that I'm happy to see candidates at the top of the polls who don't have any political experience! Lol
@ashleymc09 I too find myself a bit of a conspiracy theorist .... The specifics of which I will save for another day or keep them tucked away safely in my brain
I think if someone is planning a massive terrorist strike against the US they are not going to let being unable to emigrate as a Syrian refugee stop them.
I think my biggest frustration is that people think "being safe" is mutually exclusive from allowing refugees into the US. It's not an "either/or" argument but a lot of people would rather tow their party line than have an actual nuanced and productive discussion.
DH and I got into a big discussion on this last night in fact. And we are on the same side, mostly! But I hate when people throw out some line or meme they heard from their "side" and don't feel the need to explain or defend their position. If you can't actually explain why you feel a certain way about a topic, then maybe you should just keep your trap shut. (General "you", not directing this to anyone here!)
I'll bite. I'm socially liberal and fiscally conservative. I do not vote along party lines, ever. Neither party has all the answers. I also don't believe my vote makes one lick of difference. When the Supreme Court rolled back campaign contribution limits, they essentially gave corporations more political power than the people. And I live in a state that is so Red, it just doesn't matter how I vote.
I haven't made up my mind on President. I think Hillary is the most presidential acting with the best experience. The Republican candidate I like is not a front runner, so that probably won't be an option.
As for the refugees, I get so angry. Not allowing refugees in is exactly what the terrorists want. It isolates the Syrians and makes recruiting even easier. It is the start to the apocalyptic war they want of the West vs Islam (this is the extremists, not typical Muslims). Instead of saying "I'm trying to protect Americans" the truth is "I've given in to the terrorists."
And if you saw the pictures of the Syrian boy whose lifeless body washed up on the beach, and that didn't move you to want to help, then I have to question your humanity. How bad would your life have to get for you to take LO on a boat and set off into the sea with nothing but the clothes on your back? Forget sbout DH, he's already dead. That was this mother's best option and she lost both of her sons. We can't even fathom how awful the reality of life is because we are so damned comfortable. This whole situation makes my heart hurt. If I could personally take a family in, I would.
Terrorism aside (because yes obviously the majority of refugees are not terrorists) what are the logistics of the plan to bring all those refugees here? For me, it doesn't make sense when we have a very big homeless population here... And not saying American children are more important than Syrian children, but the American government has a responsibility first to its one citizens. So to the government they should be more important from a resource perspective.
So this is actually a real question and not a snarky observation for those more informed than me on this matter... Where exactly are they living and how are they earning a living etc?
And not saying American children are more important than Syrian children, but the American government has a responsibility first to its one citizens. So to the government they should be more important from a resource perspective.
I guess I just don't believe that Americans come first. We are the wealthiest country in the world, and our wealth was built on the backs of immigrants and refugees. Also, the homelessness problem in America is shameful, but it is not just down to a lack of housing or unemployment, it's due to our inadequate mental health and drug abuse policies.
Yeah I agree with both sides of the debate on this issue, but it seems like all you hear about from politicians is their either for it or against it, nobody seems to want to work together to come up with an actual solution to the entire problem that is best for the US and for the world. I guess that would take too much time and work lol.
I really like Ben Carson. He seems smart and down to earth. I usually vote republican, however there are a lot of issues I'm apathetic about. I do think Marijuana should be legalized and pleasure taxed to help with debt. I've personally never smoked it, I've never even had a cigarette, but like anything, as long as you're responsible, I don't care. I think gay marriage is fine, again, it doesn't affect me in any way, so what difference does it make?
Yeah I agree with both sides of the debate on this issue, but it seems like all you hear about from politicians is their either for it or against it, nobody seems to want to work together to come up with an actual solution to the entire problem that is best for the US and for the world. I guess that would take too much time and work lol.
This. Except now apply it to every political issue we have. No one wants to work together and no one wants to compromise. Our political system is broken.
@ElRuby That is a valid question. But you can say that about anything. How are we going to pay for our crumbling infrastructure? How are we going to handle immigration in general? Public education? Social security? We have always had more questions than answers. But helping humanity should always be a priority. I know in the past, the churches I have belonged to have sponsored refugee families from Africa and the Middle East by paying for housing and helping with English classes and employment and groceries until they can make it on their own. So it's not a 100% burden on tax payers. How many thousands could we help if every church sponsored one family? Isn't that the Christian thing to do?
My only problem with marijuana is the smell and smoke which can directly affect my quality of life (I vehemently oppose all public smoking so this extends to cigarettes as well)... I have a friend who shares a wall in a condo and is constantly dealing with the odor from his neighbors (similar to many of our college experiences I am sure) so for me that is where it gets tricky because I really love fresh air ... Otherwise smoke away just don't let me smell it!
See, this is why I enjoy hearing opposing opinions. Like I said, I am not as informed and involved in politics as I feel I should be. Hearing different views opens my mind and helps me become more informed. It's a shame that everything in politics seems to be black or white. Democrat or republican. I agree that helping those less fortunate should be a priority. I also know that the majority of refugees are not aiming to hurt us. However, I do worry about safety. We, as a country, need to figure out how to provide safety to everyone involved.
@Sammy K before I could really meaningfully contribute to the conversation of what to do with the refugees I would really like to hear what the actual plan is once they get here. Since it is a government and not a church related plan, I would imagine they have a comprehensive plan .... Or not.
@ElRuby Ha ha, plan? We speak in sound bites and expect problems to be solved like in sit-coms. I'm sure there is a general plan, but I don't know what. I don't have all of the answers, I just get frustrated at the people who want to slam the door and ignore it.
I'm also glad you started this thread since I don't think I can talk freely IRL. DH and I talk about all of this but otherwise I keep my opinions to myself.
And in the interest of full disclosure, the Syrian boy in the photo is the same age as my son. DH said he stared at the picture for a long time and couldn't figure out why it bothered him (other than the obvious). When he realized it was because of DS, he said he almost threw up. I still tear up just thinking about that poor, small, frightened boy being washed overboard. If we could personalize every conflict, I think we would all be a little more tolerant and a little bit kinder in all aspects of our lives.
My church is working is working on sponsoring a refugee family. I'm not worried that this exposes my family to some new danger. The U.S. is not some some violence-free utopia. We have plenty of homegrown sick, dangerous people here already. I don't worry that my child's school is going to be attacked by a terrorist, I'm worried that another student is going to bring a parent's gun to class.
@Sammy K haha good point.... But I am thinking very simplistic like where are they sleeping the first night they get here... Like as in actual plan not a hope for good will.
@ElRuby We already accept thousands of refugees per year. There are several agencies set up job is to find homes for the refugees. They don't just buy a ticket and show up at Ellis Island anymore.
Have you guys heard about Humans Of New York? They did a whole thing on Syrian refugees in Greece. It blew my mind. I cried so hard.
I am so torn about what I believe should happen. My heart is so broken for these people and I want to welcome them here. At the same time, I worry for my safety, the safety of my family, and the safety of the average Joe. I read a post that said "if there was a bowl full of M&Ms and 10 were poisoned, would you take a handful?"
The analogy is more like, "say you have a bowl of m&ms and someone told you 10 were poison. But they have no proof of that, AND each piece gets tested before you eat it."
Have you guys heard about Humans Of New York? They did a whole thing on Syrian refugees in Greece. It blew my mind. I cried so hard.
I am so torn about what I believe should happen. My heart is so broken for these people and I want to welcome them here. At the same time, I worry for my safety, the safety of my family, and the safety of the average Joe. I read a post that said "if there was a bowl full of M&Ms and 10 were poisoned, would you take a handful?"
Things like this really frustrate me. I can completely accept that people have a wide range of views on this issue, and that there are no easy answers. However, seeing as how there are literally millions of people dying; babies are dying... maybe we can refrain from comparing human life to candy.
It's obvious there are many different viewpoints here, but both sides bring up rational, valid points and questions.
I'm smart enough to know that I don't know enough about it to discuss complex issues like this. I don't have the time to really delve into the details and figure out my stance, with anything other than a gut reaction.
What drives me crazy, with anything political, are the people who don't actually understand the nuances to the problem. They hear some sound bite on Fox News or MSNBC, take that for fact, and spew their ignorance around. Or they "like" all the one-sided memes or articles on Facebook.
I actually admire the crazy zealots (on either side) because at lest they understand their position and have reasons for it.
This is why I love my husband. He is a history teacher, and one of the smartest people I know. He also has compassion and logic. He poses his thoughts to me in a very non confrontational logical way that I can understand and consider. His thoughts on refugees:
We, as a nation, are considered a world leader. How can we turn our backs on people in need and still considered ourselves as such? Fear grips people, and innocents die in the process. What will it take to look back on mistakes in the past (the holocaust, Stalin) and learn from them before thousands or millions die? Is the possible risk of 100 American lives worth the possibility of saving thousands of Syrian lives? Are our lives worth more than theirs?
I guess it just hits close to home with me, because I don't think of it as a country risk. I hear them mention the possibility that NYC is next, and I picture my husband, father of my daughter, traveling by mass transit into the city every day. I do have to consider those people in need and put myself in their shoes. I would be terrified if I were one of those mothers trying to save my family by fleeing to a different country, and they wouldn't let me in.
ElRuby
member
Re: Politics
Who's thinking about their votes for prez, and why?
Because he walks to work and flies coach. And he's been talking about the same stuff for like 20 years.
But I've said before, I no longer believe in democracy. I don't think the common voter, myself included, knows enough about the important topics of relevance to decide who is the best candidate. A more qualified panel than the average Murican should be selecting the president, from a qualified pool of applicants, IMHO. I'm ready for a perfect new political system that hasn't been designed yet. Maybe a J15 genius could get on that for me.
Sigh... Then we'd probably synthesize it and all buy it on the black market to administer to our husbands. 'Did you REALLY forget my birthday?'
It's so sad because it's such an important decision and like you said, the common voter just doesn't know enough.
@ElRuby A lot of what you said is how I feel too. I've always voted Republican but it's because I side with most of their policies, not because I'm just voting to vote. If I agreed with a democrat candidate, I would vote for them. And yeah, I would feel very uncomfortable with the govt taking away my right to vote bc they think I'm not educated enough to make the right decision. I halfway think though that the person that "they" want in office gets in office anyway, despite votes..but I'm a slight conspiracy theorist which isn't healthy I know haha.
Im not sure who I'll cast a vote for yet, but I'm so sick of lying, bought out politicians who don't seem to care about what's best for our country that I'm happy to see candidates at the top of the polls who don't have any political experience! Lol
DH and I got into a big discussion on this last night in fact. And we are on the same side, mostly! But I hate when people throw out some line or meme they heard from their "side" and don't feel the need to explain or defend their position. If you can't actually explain why you feel a certain way about a topic, then maybe you should just keep your trap shut. (General "you", not directing this to anyone here!)
I haven't made up my mind on President. I think Hillary is the most presidential acting with the best experience. The Republican candidate I like is not a front runner, so that probably won't be an option.
As for the refugees, I get so angry. Not allowing refugees in is exactly what the terrorists want. It isolates the Syrians and makes recruiting even easier. It is the start to the apocalyptic war they want of the West vs Islam (this is the extremists, not typical Muslims). Instead of saying "I'm trying to protect Americans" the truth is "I've given in to the terrorists."
And if you saw the pictures of the Syrian boy whose lifeless body washed up on the beach, and that didn't move you to want to help, then I have to question your humanity. How bad would your life have to get for you to take LO on a boat and set off into the sea with nothing but the clothes on your back? Forget sbout DH, he's already dead. That was this mother's best option and she lost both of her sons. We can't even fathom how awful the reality of life is because we are so damned comfortable. This whole situation makes my heart hurt. If I could personally take a family in, I would.
https://www.google.com/search?site=webhp&tbm=isch&source=hp&ei=DC5PVtypOInJmQGg6q-wBg&q=syrian+boy+on+beach&oq=Syrian+boy&gs_l=mobile-gws-hp.1.1.0l5.3414.8537.0.9989.12.11.1.3.3.0.367.1789.1j8j1j1.11.0....0...1c.1.64.mobile-gws-hp..0.12.1403.3.auWqYTkpUlA
I'll get off my soap box now. I need a tissue.
So this is actually a real question and not a snarky observation for those more informed than me on this matter... Where exactly are they living and how are they earning a living etc?
@ElRuby That is a valid question. But you can say that about anything. How are we going to pay for our crumbling infrastructure? How are we going to handle immigration in general? Public education? Social security? We have always had more questions than answers. But helping humanity should always be a priority. I know in the past, the churches I have belonged to have sponsored refugee families from Africa and the Middle East by paying for housing and helping with English classes and employment and groceries until they can make it on their own. So it's not a 100% burden on tax payers. How many thousands could we help if every church sponsored one family? Isn't that the Christian thing to do?
I'm also glad you started this thread since I don't think I can talk freely IRL. DH and I talk about all of this but otherwise I keep my opinions to myself.
And in the interest of full disclosure, the Syrian boy in the photo is the same age as my son. DH said he stared at the picture for a long time and couldn't figure out why it bothered him (other than the obvious). When he realized it was because of DS, he said he almost threw up. I still tear up just thinking about that poor, small, frightened boy being washed overboard. If we could personalize every conflict, I think we would all be a little more tolerant and a little bit kinder in all aspects of our lives.
2nd round exp 8/20/18.
https://www.culturalorientation.net/learning/about-refugees
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/refugees-arrive-us-expect-35271559
I am so torn about what I believe should happen. My heart is so broken for these people and I want to welcome them here. At the same time, I worry for my safety, the safety of my family, and the safety of the average Joe. I read a post that said "if there was a bowl full of M&Ms and 10 were poisoned, would you take a handful?"
2nd round exp 8/20/18.
It's obvious there are many different viewpoints here, but both sides bring up rational, valid points and questions.
I'm smart enough to know that I don't know enough about it to discuss complex issues like this. I don't have the time to really delve into the details and figure out my stance, with anything other than a gut reaction.
What drives me crazy, with anything political,
are the people who don't actually understand the nuances to the problem. They hear some sound bite on Fox News or MSNBC, take that for fact, and spew their ignorance around. Or they "like" all the one-sided memes or articles on Facebook.
I actually admire the crazy zealots (on either side) because at lest they understand their position and have reasons for it.
We, as a nation, are considered a world leader. How can we turn our backs on people in need and still considered ourselves as such? Fear grips people, and innocents die in the process. What will it take to look back on mistakes in the past (the holocaust, Stalin) and learn from them before thousands or millions die? Is the possible risk of 100 American lives worth the possibility of saving thousands of Syrian lives? Are our lives worth more than theirs?
I guess it just hits close to home with me, because I don't think of it as a country risk. I hear them mention the possibility that NYC is next, and I picture my husband, father of my daughter, traveling by mass transit into the city every day. I do have to consider those people in need and put myself in their shoes. I would be terrified if I were one of those mothers trying to save my family by fleeing to a different country, and they wouldn't let me in.