Baby Showers

Perspectives on etiquette

I find it really interesting reading so many posts about people not planning or hosting their own baby showers. Where I'm from, it's really common and not frowned upon.

I won't be hosting my own, my mum, MIL and sister will be. Just because they've said they would want to.

But, I'm just a bit astounded that there is such a strong reaction to hosting your own baby shower. I've heard of many women hosting their own and never once have I thought negatively of them for it. Nor have I ever heard anyone else say anything negative. I guess I look at it the same as a wedding, it's typical these days to request money for a wishing well, I've never been to a wedding that's had otherwise.

Not saying that it's not frowned upon in some places, but it's 100 not where I am. Just interesting the different perspectives :
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Re: Perspectives on etiquette

  • I guess you are looking at the difference between what is commonplace and what is considered proper. I do believe that where you are from it might be really common to host one's own shower, but many of the girls on this board are more interested in sharing what has been traditionally considered proper etiquette and/or what seems right to them. Any time you do something that looks like you're asking for gifts, people on here are going to point out the offensiveness if it. A wedding well is another example of something like this.

    Then again,traditional etiquette would also say a fanily member shouldn't even host your shower, only a friend. And you will find many of the girls on this board will say it's okay to disregard that rule these days. So I get what you are saying about different perspectives. The board is inconsistent bbut if you sift through the obvious flames, you will find some people genuinely trying to guide you when you ask. If you want to follow propr etiquette, get yourself a copy of a Miss Manners book. If you want to just do what everyone else in town is doing, then just do that. I will say, however, that even if it seems like 100% of everybody accepts something, there's always a chance that your grandma or the girl that moved from out of town is privately frowning upon it

  • Baby showers are the same as wedding showers. Ifyou want to compare something to a wedding, the baptism could be comparable. But a baby shower is not the same as a wedding. 
    "Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
    ~Benjamin Franklin

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  • I don't care where you live: throwing a party for the sole purpose of people bringing you gifts or asking guests to throw cash in a jar is inappropriate.

    ~ May 2011: Married ~ December 2013: NTNP ~ March 2014: Chemical Pregnancy ~
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     I love you. Maybe I'm an idiot for it, but I always have. Everything good that I try and do I do it because of you.  I try and get away but I just keep coming back. And that's because I love you.


  • You're one of the reasons I wrote this post. So quick to say that kind of thing. I get it, it's 'bad etiquette', but what I'm saying it that times change and that's not the case everywhere. In fact, I don't even look at baby showers as just a gift giving event, I look at them as a celebration for a mother or mother and father to be. Bridal showers, I look at as a last girls night before she's married. I've been to showers and not taken gifts. Because I don't believe in this day and age they're all about gifts. More about fun.
    If you're pointing our about gift giving events, then why is it ok for the mother to be to make a registry but it's not rude because the host sends it out? Clearly they are asking for gifts.
    I'm just saying, it's different everywhere and I guess where I'm from it's a lot less traditional!
  • Yeah that makes sense. I guess I'm just pointing out that traditionals get old and everywhere is different. I was just absolutely shocked at some of the rude and sarcastic replies to people who sound like they're from somewhere where it's considered ok to host your own shower.
  • In terms of gifts I meant. Let's be honest, there's a registry and wishing wells and what not. It's an event of celebration that calls for guests to bring gifts!
  • image GB30:
    You're one of the reasons I wrote this post. So quick to say that kind of thing. I get it, it's 'bad etiquette', but what I'm saying it that times change and that's not the case everywhere. In fact, I don't even look at baby showers as just a gift giving event, I look at them as a celebration for a mother or mother and father to be. Bridal showers, I look at as a last girls night before she's married. I've been to showers and not taken gifts. Because I don't believe in this day and age they're all about gifts. More about fun. If you're pointing our about gift giving events, then why is it ok for the mother to be to make a registry but it's not rude because the host sends it out? Clearly they are asking for gifts. I'm just saying, it's different everywhere and I guess where I'm from it's a lot less traditional!

    I'm assuming you're talking to me?

    I sincerely don't understand your thought process.  Bridal showers are to welcome women into the role of wives, baby showers are welcome women into motherhood.  They exist to give gifts and it's rude as hell to ask your friends to buy you things no matter the situation.

    Greed.  It's everywhere in this world these days.  It's in children, it's in brides, it's in new parents, it's in all of us.  We're trained to want MORE!!!! and not care how we get it so we've now reached the point of rationalizing these parties with "But, it's a rite of passage!!  I can't possibly survive if I don't get the EXACT baby shower I want complete with every gift and tea sandwich so I'll just throw it myself."

    Perhaps we all need an attitude adjustment and to remember some traditional etiquette. 

    ~ May 2011: Married ~ December 2013: NTNP ~ March 2014: Chemical Pregnancy ~
    image   image

     I love you. Maybe I'm an idiot for it, but I always have. Everything good that I try and do I do it because of you.  I try and get away but I just keep coming back. And that's because I love you.


  • image GB30:
    I find it really interesting reading so many posts about people not planning or hosting their own baby showers. Where I'm from, it's really common and not frowned upon.

    I won't be hosting my own, my mum, MIL and sister will be. Just because they've said they would want to.

    But, I'm just a bit astounded that there is such a strong reaction to hosting your own baby shower. I've heard of many women hosting their own and never once have I thought negatively of them for it. Nor have I ever heard anyone else say anything negative. I guess I look at it the same as a wedding, it's typical these days to request money for a wishing well, I've never been to a wedding that's had otherwise.

    Not saying that it's not frowned upon in some places, but it's 100 not where I am. Just interesting the different perspectives :


    I'm so glad you wrote this post, I agree with you so much!

    I think now a days anything goes. Where I'm from some people throw their own showers and also 2nd showers are not frowned upon. Times have changed!



  • image PaMommy02:
    image GB30:
    I find it really interesting reading so many posts about people not planning or hosting their own baby showers. Where I'm from, it's really common and not frowned upon.

    I won't be hosting my own, my mum, MIL and sister will be. Just because they've said they would want to.

    But, I'm just a bit astounded that there is such a strong reaction to hosting your own baby shower. I've heard of many women hosting their own and never once have I thought negatively of them for it. Nor have I ever heard anyone else say anything negative. I guess I look at it the same as a wedding, it's typical these days to request money for a wishing well, I've never been to a wedding that's had otherwise.

    Not saying that it's not frowned upon in some places, but it's 100 not where I am. Just interesting the different perspectives :


    I'm so glad you wrote this post, I agree with you so much!

    I think now a days anything goes. Where I'm from some people throw their own showers and also 2nd showers are not frowned upon. Times have changed!


    Yes exactly, times have changed! I was so sick of coming on here looking at baby shower posts and all I saw was rude and sarcastic response after rude and sarcastic response to people.
    My grandma believes it's tradition for a woman to do all the work in the kitchen, that's not something everyone believes, in fact hardly anyone at all cause it's dated! I'm glad you also share my view :
  • I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.  I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.

    Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.  Pure and simple.

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  • image MelRC117:

    Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.  Pure and simple.

    seriously. Women no longer "belonging" in the kitchen isn't the same as it being ok to throwing your own gift giving party. One is about equality, the other is about greed 
    "Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
    ~Benjamin Franklin

    Lilypie Third Birthday tickers
    DS dx with celiac disease 5/28/10

  • image chattychiqa:
    image GB30:
    image PaMommy02:
    image GB30:
    I find it really interesting reading so many posts about people not planning or hosting their own baby showers. Where I'm from, it's really common and not frowned upon.

    I won't be hosting my own, my mum, MIL and sister will be. Just because they've said they would want to.

    But, I'm just a bit astounded that there is such a strong reaction to hosting your own baby shower. I've heard of many women hosting their own and never once have I thought negatively of them for it. Nor have I ever heard anyone else say anything negative. I guess I look at it the same as a wedding, it's typical these days to request money for a wishing well, I've never been to a wedding that's had otherwise.

    Not saying that it's not frowned upon in some places, but it's 100 not where I am. Just interesting the different perspectives :


    I'm so glad you wrote this post, I agree with you so much!

    I think now a days anything goes. Where I'm from some people throw their own showers and also 2nd showers are not frowned upon. Times have changed!


    Yes exactly, times have changed! I was so sick of coming on here looking at baby shower posts and all I saw was rude and sarcastic response after rude and sarcastic response to people.
    My grandma believes it's tradition for a woman to do all the work in the kitchen, that's not something everyone believes, in fact hardly anyone at all cause it's dated! I'm glad you also share my view :


    It's the Internet. There is snark everywhere. I'm not saying I like it when I'm subjected or there's obvious meanness but it's the nature of the beast.


    It's sad when this is supposed to be a place for mums or mums to be. Scares me that the rude and negative people on here have or are having children yet treat people like that. Can't believe others like bringing people down for fun.
  • image MelRC117:
    I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.nbsp; I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.nbsp; Pure and simple.


    And this post only proved my point that there's people who can't get over the fact that times HAVE changed. Call it what you want, but all I'm saying is that etiquette is picked and chosen to suit people. That's life, yes. People need to respect other people's choices or views, or simple keep their mouths closed. If someone comes on here asking for advice about hosting their own shower and you don't agree, don't comment. Simple. They obviously have a valid reason for wanting to host their own. Does not make them a greedy or horrible person !
  • image GB30:
    image chattychiqa:
    image GB30:
    image PaMommy02:
    image GB30:
    I find it really interesting reading so many posts about people not planning or hosting their own baby showers. Where I'm from, it's really common and not frowned upon. I won't be hosting my own, my mum, MIL and sister will be. Just because they've said they would want to. But, I'm just a bit astounded that there is such a strong reaction to hosting your own baby shower. I've heard of many women hosting their own and never once have I thought negatively of them for it. Nor have I ever heard anyone else say anything negative. I guess I look at it the same as a wedding, it's typical these days to request money for a wishing well, I've never been to a wedding that's had otherwise. Not saying that it's not frowned upon in some places, but it's 100 not where I am. Just interesting the different perspectives :
    I'm so glad you wrote this post, I agree with you so much! I think now a days anything goes. Where I'm from some people throw their own showers and also 2nd showers are not frowned upon. Times have changed!
    Yes exactly, times have changed! I was so sick of coming on here looking at baby shower posts and all I saw was rude and sarcastic response after rude and sarcastic response to people. My grandma believes it's tradition for a woman to do all the work in the kitchen, that's not something everyone believes, in fact hardly anyone at all cause it's dated! I'm glad you also share my view :
    It's the Internet. There is snark everywhere. I'm not saying I like it when I'm subjected or there's obvious meanness but it's the nature of the beast.
    It's sad when this is supposed to be a place for mums or mums to be. Scares me that the rude and negative people on here have or are having children yet treat people like that. Can't believe others like bringing people down for fun.

    OH GOD. Yet you're here preaching about different "perspectives" on etiquette. Yes, call CPS on us immediately.

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  • image EastCoastBride:
    image MelRC117:

    Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.  Pure and simple.

    seriously. Women no longer "belonging" in the kitchen isn't the same as it being ok to throwing your own gift giving party. One is about equality, the other is about greed 

    This.

    "Times have changed" is not an excuse to not have manners.  


    image image image 

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  • image GB30:
    image MelRC117:
    I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.nbsp; I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.nbsp; Pure and simple.
    And this post only proved my point that there's people who can't get over the fact that times HAVE changed. Call it what you want, but all I'm saying is that etiquette is picked and chosen to suit people. That's life, yes. People need to respect other people's choices or views, or simple keep their mouths closed. If someone comes on here asking for advice about hosting their own shower and you don't agree, don't comment. Simple. They obviously have a valid reason for wanting to host their own. Does not make them a greedy or horrible person !

    Picked and chosen by people so they can be justified to throw themselves their own party which sole purpose is to receive gifts.  You want us to keep our mouths closed ONLY because we disagree with you.  You wrote a whole post, yet others have to keep their mouths closed.  Hypocrite.

    If people ASK FOR OPINIONS ON THE INTERNET, then they are going to get a variety of responses. Again, ITS THE INTERNET.  Why should only people that agree with the poster respond?  Then what's the point of posting if you're just going to have people that agree with you respond?

    The only valid reason for hosting your own shower is that you want free stuff.  What are the other reasonings?  Use the money that would be used to pay for the shower and BUY YOUR KID'S STUFF YOURSELF.  Or would you force people to bring their own food to eat in addition to their gift?

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  • image GB30:
    image MelRC117:
    I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.nbsp; I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.nbsp; Pure and simple.
    And this post only proved my point that there's people who can't get over the fact that times HAVE changed. Call it what you want, but all I'm saying is that etiquette is picked and chosen to suit people. That's life, yes. People need to respect other people's choices or views, or simple keep their mouths closed. If someone comes on here asking for advice about hosting their own shower and you don't agree, don't comment. Simple. They obviously have a valid reason for wanting to host their own. Does not make them a greedy or horrible person !

    How can I possibly respect someone who doesn't respect me?  It's a two way street.  You want gifts, parties, and everyone else to pay for it.  Why does that mean my wallet has to suffer?  Why don't you appreciate the generosity of your friends?  Why don't you CARE that your demands are a burden to other people? 

    I seriously can't understand this logic.  Just stop and think about how what YOU want affects other people.  Just... step outside yourself.   THAT is what etiquette is - it's thinking about everyone else before yourself and making sure they are comfortable.  THAT is missing your posts, in your demands for a shower, and in your "Celebrate MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!" and THAT is where you are wrong.

    ~ May 2011: Married ~ December 2013: NTNP ~ March 2014: Chemical Pregnancy ~
    image   image

     I love you. Maybe I'm an idiot for it, but I always have. Everything good that I try and do I do it because of you.  I try and get away but I just keep coming back. And that's because I love you.


  • image PaMommy02:
    image GB30:
    I find it really interesting reading so many posts about people not planning or hosting their own baby showers. Where I'm from, it's really common and not frowned upon. I won't be hosting my own, my mum, MIL and sister will be. Just because they've said they would want to. But, I'm just a bit astounded that there is such a strong reaction to hosting your own baby shower. I've heard of many women hosting their own and never once have I thought negatively of them for it. Nor have I ever heard anyone else say anything negative. I guess I look at it the same as a wedding, it's typical these days to request money for a wishing well, I've never been to a wedding that's had otherwise. Not saying that it's not frowned upon in some places, but it's 100 not where I am. Just interesting the different perspectives :
    I'm so glad you wrote this post, I agree with you so much! I think now a days anything goes. Where I'm from some people throw their own showers and also 2nd showers are not frowned upon. Times have changed!

    Times have changed PaMommy02:

    http://community.thebump.com/cs/ks/forums/thread/75368284.aspx

    Like you said "Anything goes!"

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  • Also, proper etiquette is black and white...there is no room for debate. It will never change to be proper etiquette to throw a gift giving event for yourself. 

    image image image 

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  • image GB30:
    image MelRC117:
    I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.nbsp; I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.nbsp; Pure and simple.
    And this post only proved my point that there's people who can't get over the fact that times HAVE changed. Call it what you want, but all I'm saying is that etiquette is picked and chosen to suit people. That's life, yes. People need to respect other people's choices or views, or simple keep their mouths closed. If someone comes on here asking for advice about hosting their own shower and you don't agree, don't comment. Simple. They obviously have a valid reason for wanting to host their own. Does not make them a greedy or horrible person !

    Are we seriously having this conversation, AGAIN? 

    When will people learn learn that being polite, which is what proper etiquette is about, is not something you can "pick and choose" on? Just because no one says anything aloud that would indicate they think your actions are rude, it doesn't mean they aren't saying it behind your back or at the very least in their heads. If they aren't, well that's just because they are just as rude and clueless as the rest of your circle. Stop making excuses for begging others to provide for your child/household. 

    If your intention is to "do whatever you want" anyway, then why bother coming on this board? Take your ball and go home. I promise your contributions, and I use that term loosely, will not be missed. 

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  • image MelRC117:

    I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.  I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.

    Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.  Pure and simple.

    Yes.  Times have changed.  For the worse. 

    OP, you can't be serious.

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    image MelRC117:

    I feel the "times have changed" reasoning is ridiculous.  I'm sure the only reason deep down people are okay with people throwing their own showers is it allows them to do it as well.

    Times have changed, people are ridiculously greedy.  Pure and simple.

    Yes.  Times have changed.  For the worse. 

    OP, you can't be serious.

    Exactly. Our culture is just turning into this ME ME ME ITS ALL ABOUT ME consumerism fest, and the mentality that it's somehow acceptable to throw yourself a gift giving party only feeds into that.

    OP, you pulled the classic "I feel sorry for your children" line, but think about it: what are we teaching our children when we say "Forget about etiquette- I want people to buy me stuff!"

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  • image Joy2611:

    image GB30:
    You're one of the reasons I wrote this post. So quick to say that kind of thing. I get it, it's 'bad etiquette', but what I'm saying it that times change and that's not the case everywhere. In fact, I don't even look at baby showers as just a gift giving event, I look at them as a celebration for a mother or mother and father to be. Bridal showers, I look at as a last girls night before she's married. I've been to showers and not taken gifts. Because I don't believe in this day and age they're all about gifts. More about fun. If you're pointing our about gift giving events, then why is it ok for the mother to be to make a registry but it's not rude because the host sends it out? Clearly they are asking for gifts. I'm just saying, it's different everywhere and I guess where I'm from it's a lot less traditional!

    I'm assuming you're talking to me?

    I sincerely don't understand your thought process.  Bridal showers are to welcome women into the role of wives, baby showers are welcome women into motherhood.  They exist to give gifts and it's rude as hell to ask your friends to buy you things no matter the situation.

    Greed.  It's everywhere in this world these days.  It's in children, it's in brides, it's in new parents, it's in all of us.  We're trained to want MORE!!!! and not care how we get it so we've now reached the point of rationalizing these parties with "But, it's a rite of passage!!  I can't possibly survive if I don't get the EXACT baby shower I want complete with every gift and tea sandwich so I'll just throw it myself."

    Perhaps we all need an attitude adjustment and to remember some traditional etiquette. 

    YES YES YES.  All the crap you think you "need," you really only need about 10% of it.  But we live in a greedy consumer culture that tells us we have to have all this unnecessary crap (I'm looking at you, second baby shower), a culture where AWing is not nearly as side-eyed as it should be (I'm looking at you, gender reveal party), and a culture where people think that just because "everyone" is doing something, it's not rude (DON'T FREAKING HOST YOUR OWN SHOWER).   

    Rant over. 


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  • I actually don't even say the word etiquette anymore because that tends to go over people's heads. 

    Listen, throwing your own shower is never a polite thing to do.  No matter what you think, it comes across as crass, greedy and rude. 

  • I want to comment on a couple of points, but I'm not going to quote them because I'm not sure how to quote multiple people who didn't quote each other in the same post. (Note to self: search FAQs for that...)

    Re: "If you don't like it, don't respond." Generally speaking, I don't post on these boards to hear only what I want to hear and get validation for my choices. I want to hear different perspectives, and it's not realistic to expect only like-minded people to respond to my posts when I put something out there asking for feedback, opinions, and experiences. I like to hear from others and learn something from them, especially with respect to etiquette, because there is such variation in different social circles.

    Re: etiquette. While some traditional faux pas are now "acceptable" to some people, I agree that the general rules regarding manners and courtesy are firmly established and there's not much--if any--wiggle room. It's just that people care less about that and more about their own interests, which is an unfortunate societal trend. There is a pervasive sense of entitlement influencing the behavior of children and adults alike, and for many people, hosting your own baby shower and having showers for subsequent children are examples of that mentality. Doing either of those things conveys the message that you think other people should provide you with the things that you need, and proves that you have no problem asking them to do so, which is never acceptable.

    The difference is that here (and online in general) you will get honest responses and feedback (which are usually not "rude" even if it's hard for you to swallow), whereas your friends and family probably aren't going to tell you to your face that you're being selfish for having three baby showers in four years because you're having your first boy, you need more diapers, or whatever. I, for one, appreciate that honesty because I don't want to inadvertently disrespect my friends and family.

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  • image MosyMama:

    I want to comment on a couple of points, but I'm not going to quote them because I'm not sure how to quote multiple people who didn't quote each other in the same post. (Note to self: search FAQs for that...)

    Re: "If you don't like it, don't respond." Generally speaking, I don't post on these boards to hear only what I want to hear and get validation for my choices. I want to hear different perspectives, and it's not realistic to expect only like-minded people to respond to my posts when I put something out there asking for feedback, opinions, and experiences. I like to hear from others and learn something from them, especially with respect to etiquette, because there is such variation in different social circles.

    Re: etiquette. While some traditional faux pas are now "acceptable" to some people, I agree that the general rules regarding manners and courtesy are firmly established and there's not much--if any--wiggle room. It's just that people care less about that and more about their own interests, which is an unfortunate societal trend. There is a pervasive sense of entitlement influencing the behavior of children and adults alike, and for many people, hosting your own baby shower and having showers for subsequent children are examples of that mentality. Doing either of those things conveys the message that you think other people should provide you with the things that you need, and proves that you have no problem asking them to do so, which is never acceptable.

    The difference is that here (and online in general) you will get honest responses and feedback (which are usually not "rude" even if it's hard for you to swallow), whereas your friends and family probably aren't going to tell you to your face that you're being selfish for having three baby showers in four years because you're having your first boy, you need more diapers, or whatever. I, for one, appreciate that honesty because I don't want to inadvertently disrespect my friends and family.

    Well said.

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  • Oh goodie.  Another person trying to come in and educate all of us about "times changing."  Just because people do something doesn't make it right.

    1. I've seen 14 year old girls wear incredibly short skirts to funerals.  I guess her parents thought that "times had changed."  Everyone else was appalled at her lack of respect for the situation and the inappropriateness of her outfit. 

    2.  16 and pregnant has made teen pregnancy seem like the thing to do.  Back in my day, and no, I'm not that old, being a pregnant teen was a bad thing.  Now you get on TV for it and it's the "norm."  Still doesn't make it right, does it?

    3.  Schools are handing out condoms to 11-13 year olds, in middle school.  While I believe in protecting kids above all, it's become the "norm" that middle school kids are going to have sex.  I guess times have changed...

    Look, I could go on and on.  You can find anyway you want to justify rude behavior, and you'll probably have a chorus of similar-minded twits singing your praises, because they don't understand what sort of position it puts other people in.  It's all "I want to be a pretty princess and have people LOOK AT ME!!!"

    Bottom line:  Unless you are comfortable calling your friends and family up and saying "hey Aunt Susie...I want you to buy me a gift because I'm procreating!  Come over at this time and give it to me!  I'll give you some finger sandwiches!  And you'll get the pleasure of 'oooohing' and 'aaaaahing' over ME!!", then you should NEVER host your own shower. 

    I swear...WTF are people thinking these days?  Yeah, times have certainly changed.  Just because it changes doesn't mean that it ends up in a better place.

  • I don't even know where to begin because most of the PPs have said it best.

    FWIW, OP, just because people disagree with you does not make them rude.  It means they DISAGREE.  There is a difference.

    And when people ask for opinions, they will get them.  Whether their opinion is in line with your own or if it differs.  

    I really, really hope this is MUD.   

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  • Am I crazy for thinking it's rude/tacky for esentially holding a fundraiser for yourself? That's basically what you're doing when hosting your own gift giving event. I defintiely think a basic bare minimum should be met when it comes to ettiquette, and having a fundraiser for yourself doesn't cut it. IMHO, a good guideline to follow is a *combination* of what's acceptable in your region/culture as well as general ettiquette. I don't think you should have to compromise the majority of cultural or even regional traditions, but you also have to ask yourself if something is truly a tradition, or just an influx of recent changes due to self-entitlement. If you don't want to hear opposing opinions, why bother going on an internet forum? It's pretty close minded to demand only like-minded opinions, otherwise how else would we learn from each other?? Again...it just goes back to the narcissism and self-entitlement that seems to be taking over society these days. If you can't handle the heat, then get out of the kitchen.
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