Natural Birth

I think this needs to be said

Do some of you not realize this board has many regulars who have given birth with epidurals and even by cesarean?  Because it does.  And some of us will give birth that way in the future.  Think about that before you post.
image

Big sister {September 2008} Sweet boy {April 2011} Fuzzy Bundle {ETA July 2014}

Pregnancy Ticker
«1

Re: I think this needs to be said

  • ((HUGS))

    Especially when there are 2 stories below of women feeling like failures for not achieving their goal of a med free birth. It's not exactly supporting "our own" when we condemn others who made the same choices because they are "lazy" or "ignorant". I do maintain that the chick in question was being deliberately obtuse, but it's her choice, and like you've said many times, the responsibility for accurate information and proper care for women in childbirth is on the doctor moreso than the woman.

    I do understand getting frustrated at the system and then I don't know...taking it out on women who make "unedcuated" decisions, but it doesn't make it right nor helpful. It's just like crazy BFing women who condemn people for using formula not even knowing the circumstances (not that there's ever and excuse to condemn that choice...you know what I mean).

  • Thank you! (Again!)  I had an epi with my 1st.  I wasn't "uninformed" or "lazy."  It was the right choice for me at the time.  I also always said I wanted it as soon as possible.

    However, I did not have a good experience.  It caused my blood pressure to plummet and I passed out between every push.  I have very little memory of his birth.  I want a different experience this time.

    image
    Baby Birthday Ticker TickerBaby Birthday Ticker Ticker
  • image star173:

    ((HUGS))

    Especially when there are 2 stories below of women feeling like failures for not achieving their goal of a med free birth. It's not exactly supporting "our own" when we condemn others who made the same choices because they are "lazy" or "ignorant". I do maintain that the chick in question was being deliberately obtuse, but it's her choice, and like you've said many times, the responsibility for accurate information and proper care for women in childbirth is on the doctor moreso than the woman.

    I do understand getting frustrated at the system and then I don't know...taking it out on women who make "unedcuated" decisions, but it doesn't make it right nor helpful. It's just like crazy BFing women who condemn people for using formula not even knowing the circumstances (not that there's ever and excuse to condemn that choice...you know what I mean).

    Exactly.  Personally, I've made peace with how my first birth went and I even value it now for the perspective and experience it gave me.  But it took me a while to get to this point and I know there are ladies here who are still in that process.  Or who unfortunately will find themselves in that process in the future.

    I just often wonder if some people see "Natural Birth board" and fail to realize that there are women here with many different experiences.  

    image

    Big sister {September 2008} Sweet boy {April 2011} Fuzzy Bundle {ETA July 2014}

    Pregnancy Ticker
  • ::claps::

          DS1 - 8/07           DD2 - 2/13           DD1 - 3/11          DS2 - 1/09 

    image
  • I was uninformed about birth with my first and didn't WANT to be informed!  I was perfectly happy going along with everything and "taking the easy way out" because I didn't have to make decisions.  It sucked, and I paid dearly for not being in charge of my own birth.

     The more I researched the more I realized how different my experience could've been.  I'm not angry or hurt at my birth experience, but I know that I never want to go through that again and I think natural birth is the best option for me this time.

    *clarifying, the easy way out was not being informed or making decisions, not getting an epi* 

  • I also think we all have different reasons for choosing a natural birth. The OP in the previous post mentions "drugging the baby" in a very judgmental way. I can see how if you see an epi as equal to drugging your newborn, you'd feel sanctimonious about that choice too.

    For me, for instance having a natural birth was less about wanting to avoid drugs but more about wanting more control over the process -- to avoid a possible cascade of interventions and an overly medicalized process.

    But then again, I'm the type of person who would research colonscopies and any other medical procedure because there ARE often alternatives, and not every physician follows the latest in evidence-based medicine.
    image
    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
  • Agreed. Woman-blaming instead of realizing the entire maternity care system is broken just pisses me off.
    DS1 - Feb 2008

    DS2 - Oct 2010 (my VBAC baby!)

  • I also think that people need to reserve their judgment until after they have actually given birth once.  And even then, reserve their judgment until they have given birth with something like a posterior baby or a necessary induction or a medical condition that interferes with birth in the normal sense.  There are so many things that can happen that we don't picture happening when we're on the "natural birth soapbox". 

    And FWIW, I had an epi with #1.  I went into it wanting a natural birth and I wasn't lazy or uninformed.  I swore I would never get an epi.  I read up and had a birth plan, but when those contractions starting coming on strong and I realized he was posterior, all that education went out the window. 

    It's just so easy to make blanket statements about women's choices until you've experienced it.

          DS1 - 8/07           DD2 - 2/13           DD1 - 3/11          DS2 - 1/09 

    image
  • As a FTM, I've done a LOT of research. But that's just how I am. I've also found a million things I could rant about that I don't. Because I know I don't know everything. I've never done this before.  And I try not to be judgemental. Plenty of things bother me about birth, doctors and mothers included. But MY birth is and will always be my main focus. Some people just can't do that.... but for myself, it stresses me out more to go and judge everyone else that way. Ranting in general I find stressful. *Somebody* needs to think calm thoughts and quit worrying about other people.
    BabyFetus Ticker
  •  Thank you Iris for this post!  Thanks to you and the other understanding ladies I'm coping with my birth experience better.  If....big if....I have another child I hope to go med-free,but I'm also not setting myself up for the beating I've dealt myself with this birth. 

    It sickens me that most things in life are becoming a pissing contest.  I know the world isn't all puppies and rainbows,but a little sympathy/empathy/ and understanding go a long way.  I'm also learning that when it comes to parenting,birth included, you can plan all you want...but when reality steps in those plans go out the window in a heart beat.  You'll(most women) do anything to ensure your child(ren) are safe/healthy/and loved.  

     

    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
  • ::Coming out of lurking::

    I am one of the lurkers Iris was talking about.

    With my latest birth, I went in wanting an epidural as soon as the anesthesiologist was ready, as I did with DD.  But this time I also knew that DD (2 years old) would likely be with us for awhile when I was in labor while we waited for my parents to drive the two hours (which became three due to rush hour) to pick her up.

    It was very important to me that I not scare DD if/when I went into labor.  So I started lurking here, trying to pick up some coping tips and ways to stay in control and relax as much as possible until I could get pain relief or an epidural.

    Sure enough, my water broke, and HARD contractions started within 45 minutes, as we were pulling out to go to the hospital.  I used what skills I had learned here to keep a controlled, focused, moan. 

    Three hours after my water broke, between finishing packing, driving to the hospital, and being admitted, I finally got an epidural, and all was well in my world again.  But I am very grateful for the coping skills for the meantime that I learned here, as DD was never frightened, and was perfectly content watching Finding Nemo, eating craisins, and drinking chocolate milk at my bedside (and occasionally giving me the sideeye if my moaning interrupted Nemo.)

    I just really, really, really detest people who imply that I put my children at risk because I chose pain relief.  It was the best choice for my children and I, and I hate that some expect me to defend my choices.

    image Lilypie Fifth Birthday tickers Lilypie Second Birthday tickers Lilypie Pregnancy tickers
  • image star173:

    I do understand getting frustrated at the system and then I don't know...taking it out on women who make "unedcuated" decisions, but it doesn't make it right nor helpful. It's just like crazy BFing women who condemn people for using formula not even knowing the circumstances (not that there's ever and excuse to condemn that choice...you know what I mean).

    I totally agree with this.  I also laugh a little to myself at all the women who are so high and mighty about natural birth - and who HAVEN'T given birth yet.  I was probably one of them before my DD1 was born, and although I did have the natural birth I wanted, I am no longer judgey about epis.

    Traveling the world with my girls - born 12 months and 18 days apart.
    <a href="http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y161/putalittlepolkainyourdot/?action=view
  • image nosoup4u:
    Agreed. Woman-blaming instead of realizing the entire maternity care system is broken just pisses me off.

    AND this, too.

    Traveling the world with my girls - born 12 months and 18 days apart.
    <a href="http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y161/putalittlepolkainyourdot/?action=view
  • image roundtheworldgirl:

    I totally agree with this.  I also laugh a little to myself at all the women who are so high and mighty about natural birth - and who HAVEN'T given birth yet.  I was probably one of them before my DD1 was born, and although I did have the natural birth I wanted, I am no longer judgey about epis.

     I was a bit of an ignorant first time mom, and not just about childbirth.  My DH and I thought that if we did everything "right" I would have this magical birth experience and then have a perfect babymoon where I would spend hours nursing and cuddling in quiet bliss with DS.  Birth b****-slapped me and I quickly learned that the only thing certain about being a parent is that there is lots of uncertainty, and that babies (and birth) can have a mind of their own.  I'd like to think that I am a better person because of it all :)  

    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
  • image MrsS2203:

     It sickens me that most things in life are becoming a pissing contest.    


     

    Yep, so annoying! 
    DS born via c/s 11/08 and med-free GD VBAC DD 3/11! Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
  • image jsabouh:
    YesParty!!!

    x1,000

    Not every pregnancy can or should end in a natural birth. As long as mom & baby are healthy, it doesn't really matter.

  • People do need to less judgmental regardless of what choice others make. I've never given birth before but I know that I want to give birth naturally but I dont criticize anyone for wanting something different. I've done my research and feel thats the best thing for me at this time...things might change when I go into labor Smile.  I also think you cant just decide to give birth naturally. You have to prepare your body and your mind for it. Reading the material doesnt seem like it would cut it.

    A fact is that most women are not informed about the choices they have and the pros and cons for each choice. It seems like we are not encouraged to research all possibilities but to follow the doctor blindly.

  • Well said.  I remember my MIL saying what a great birth I had and the reason behind that was that I prepared for it, took care of myself, etc.  My response was that a lot of it just came down to luck.  And that is true for everyone who has had a med-free birth, a lot of it is just the hand you are dealt, end of story.
    image




    Lilypie Fourth Birthday tickers Lilypie Second Birthday tickers
  • image TwoSkis:

    ::Coming out of lurking::

    I am one of the lurkers Iris was talking about.

    With my latest birth, I went in wanting an epidural as soon as the anesthesiologist was ready, as I did with DD.  But this time I also knew that DD (2 years old) would likely be with us for awhile when I was in labor while we waited for my parents to drive the two hours (which became three due to rush hour) to pick her up.

    It was very important to me that I not scare DD if/when I went into labor.  So I started lurking here, trying to pick up some coping tips and ways to stay in control and relax as much as possible until I could get pain relief or an epidural.

    Sure enough, my water broke, and HARD contractions started within 45 minutes, as we were pulling out to go to the hospital.  I used what skills I had learned here to keep a controlled, focused, moan. 

    Three hours after my water broke, between finishing packing, driving to the hospital, and being admitted, I finally got an epidural, and all was well in my world again.  But I am very grateful for the coping skills for the meantime that I learned here, as DD was never frightened, and was perfectly content watching Finding Nemo, eating craisins, and drinking chocolate milk at my bedside (and occasionally giving me the sideeye if my moaning interrupted Nemo.)

    I just really, really, really detest people who imply that I put my children at risk because I chose pain relief.  It was the best choice for my children and I, and I hate that some expect me to defend my choices.

    Thank you for posting this!  And your children are beautiful! 

    image




    Lilypie Fourth Birthday tickers Lilypie Second Birthday tickers
  • Totally 100% agree Iris. I've had one of each. Personally, I get irritated with such strong opinions for those who have never actually given birth. It's right up there with a man having a strong opinion regarding how a woman handles her birth in my book.
    Lilypie Third Birthday tickers
    Lilypie Second Birthday tickers
    image


  • image somebodysmama21:
    Why is so hard to understand that I am not saying that if you have an epi or a c section you are lazy I am saying that is you just dont want to do any research it seems lazy to me....but maybe reread my post and read it unprepared instead of lazy would that be better? Anyway I do realize that anything can change at the drop of a hat and I am prepared for that.  I have been taking care of new borns for years and rooming in with new moms to help them, I realize how totally and completely unpredictable it all is and I realize how awful it is when things dont go your way. But when they dont go your way because you never really decided what you wanted your way to be you cant really be upset.

    Why is it so hard to understand that your post came off as extremely condescending & judgmental?  I didn't necessarily follow my OB "blindly" last time, but definitely trusted too much & ended up with less than stellar care, complications, & a c/s as a result. When I read your post, it was hurtful. Yes, I'm doing a lot more research & will hopefully have a much better outcome with my next LO, but I don't think it's "lazy" or "unprepared" to trust someone who is supposed to be an expert in the birthing process. In the post quoted above, you seem to be saying that I shouldn't feel negative about my birthing experience because I trusted my OB, who is, again, SUPPOSED TO BE AN EXPERT. People learn new things based on experience & grow & change. Get an effing clue. 

    Furthermore, just because you have taken care of newborns & helped new moms does not mean you know what it is like to give birth yourself nor have your own baby. As the saying goes, "I was a perfect parent before I had kids." 

    As a pp mentioned, we shouldn't be blaming women, rather we should recognize the whole maternity process is really whack in this country. Your post was ridiculous, not to mention poorly written, erroneously punctuated, & grammatically incorrect. 

    imageimage


    Certified Positive Discipline Educator

    "Remember: You're not managing an inconvenience, you're raising a human being." - Kittie Frantz


    Ari has 3 food allergies/sensitivities, down from 21 @ 16 months! Mama is Gluten & Dairy free.


    image
    image
    image
  • I don't have a problem with a woman giving birth however she chooses. I do wish more women had more choices, and more women knew that they could have an opinion. I learned a long time ago that doctors can make mistakes and are no more than human... some people never learn that lesson. Some people learn it after a $hitty birth experience, and that's no fun.

  • Yep. I use to be a regular on this board, but quit posting, and eventually stopped coming here because I got tired of the type of posts that you are reffering to. Most of my TB friends choose pain relief and I didn't want them to associate me with those types of posts/people. I'm glad Iris is here to smack some sense into those that need it!
    252855_10150214241312114_262494087113_7012916_3895481_n-2Uploaded from the Photobucket iPhone App
    Lilypie Second Birthday tickersLilypie Fourth Birthday tickers BabyFruit Ticker Siggy check.
  • I for one am all for natural birth.  I would never be hateful to someone who needed a c-section as a lifesaving measure.  With my 6th child I almost had to have an emergency one.  I think it's crazy to schedule one ahead of time just to avoid pain in labor.  My brother's girlfriend had their 1st baby vaginally and he weighed 9 lbs and she had no problems.  I have to admit I was shocked that she went through it with no pain killers or anything.  She is one who just blindly does whatever the dr says and doesn't think to question anything...ever.  With the 2nd one she set up a c-section early because the all-knowing dr told her the baby was to big for her to push out.  He came out weighing 9 lbs.  I never did ask her why because she would just say..."the dr said so, he's the expert"  These are also the same 2 people who think I'm odd because I breastfeed and I'm not going to circumcise this baby even though my other 2 sons are.  My dear brother actually said to me that he wants his sons to look normal.
    BabyFetus Ticker
  • Well I hate to think I intentionally offended someone.  I would never try to call someone out specifically to hurt their feelings.  I don't want to be the meanie.  But we're all different.  It's a message board full of differing opinions.  How can you not be offended at some point?  Are we supposed to all be sunshine and roses and blow smoke up each other's butts instead of giving our real raw thoughts?  If so I wouldn't care to be here . What good would that be?  For example I could be slightly offended at the notion that someone who hasn't had kids yet shouldn't have a strong opinion about natural birth.  But I don't get offended because I really think about the comment and realize it doesn't even make good sense.  When am I supposed to get the strong opinions about natural birth, after I don't educate myself and have a bad experience with an over managed intervention birth as a result?  This is going to be my only child, what good would that do me then?  No, I don't get offended, I just move along and keep reading the posts.  That's how you get well rounded advice; you listen to everyone, the sweet and sour. 

    And I know that it's the maternity system we should all be mad, if you have to be mad at someone.  But the only persons with the power to change that system is the women being treated by it.  And if those women just deal with it with the attitude there's nothing they can do and it just is the way it is they aren't helping matters but perpetuating the problem.  Is that their right?  Surely so.  But it still irritates me that I'm having to deal with a crappy system in part because some refuse to question it even though they want to.  I just realize we all have to speak for ourselves now and hopefully one day we'll have a choice. 

    Baby Birthday Ticker Ticker
  • image cottonlily84:

    Well I hate to think I intentionally offended someone.  I would never try to call someone out specifically to hurt their feelings.  I don't want to be the meanie.  But we're all different.  It's a message board full of differing opinions.  How can you not be offended at some point?  Are we supposed to all be sunshine and roses and blow smoke up each other's butts instead of giving our real raw thoughts?  If so I wouldn't care to be here . What good would that be?  For example I could be slightly offended at the notion that someone who hasn't had kids yet shouldn't have a strong opinion about natural birth.  But I don't get offended because I really think about the comment and realize it doesn't even make good sense.  When am I supposed to get the strong opinions about natural birth, after I don't educate myself and have a bad experience with an over managed intervention birth as a result?  This is going to be my only child, what good would that do me then?  No, I don't get offended, I just move along and keep reading the posts.  That's how you get well rounded advice; you listen to everyone, the sweet and sour. 

    And I know that it's the maternity system we should all be mad, if you have to be mad at someone.  But the only persons with the power to change that system is the women being treated by it.  And if those women just deal with it with the attitude there's nothing they can do and it just is the way it is they aren't helping matters but perpetuating the problem.  Is that their right?  Surely so.  But it still irritates me that I'm having to deal with a crappy system in part because some refuse to question it even though they want to.  I just realize we all have to speak for ourselves now and hopefully one day we'll have a choice. 

    I know I'm a little late to the party but I agree with this. I shouldn't have to tip toe around and not speak my opinion because someone else didn't get the birth they wanted. I feel bad for people that don't get the birth they want but it is what it is. I think more women just need to own their decisions better. Even if those decisions were not what was planned and made in the heat of the moment. If you chose an epi or needed a c-section then that is what was right for you and your LO at the time. Own that decision and be proud of yourself for bringing your baby into the world the way that worked for you.
  • image cottonlily84:


    And I know that it's the maternity system we should all be mad, if you have to be mad at someone.  But the only persons with the power to change that system is the women being treated by it.  And if those women just deal with it with the attitude there's nothing they can do and it just is the way it is they aren't helping matters but perpetuating the problem.  Is that their right?  Surely so.  But it still irritates me that I'm having to deal with a crappy system in part because some refuse to question it even though they want to.  I just realize we all have to speak for ourselves now and hopefully one day we'll have a choice. 

    Uh, don't doctors, hospitals and groups like ACOG have more of an ability to change the system than individual women? One individual --> not very much power to affect change. Organized groups running the show have a bit more say in policies that affect those women.

    It's really ridiculous to expect every woman to go into birth 100% prepared for every situation possible and be on the defense with her provider. If the system wasn't broken and effed up, women would be able to trust their providers not to do unneccesary interventions and/or c-sections (especially as it's sorta hard for a pregnant woman in labor to administer her own epidural).

    DS1 - Feb 2008

    DS2 - Oct 2010 (my VBAC baby!)

  • image Sharon21:
    image cottonlily84:

    Well I hate to think I intentionally offended someone.  I would never try to call someone out specifically to hurt their feelings.  I don't want to be the meanie.  But we're all different.  It's a message board full of differing opinions.  How can you not be offended at some point?  Are we supposed to all be sunshine and roses and blow smoke up each other's butts instead of giving our real raw thoughts?  If so I wouldn't care to be here . What good would that be?  For example I could be slightly offended at the notion that someone who hasn't had kids yet shouldn't have a strong opinion about natural birth.  But I don't get offended because I really think about the comment and realize it doesn't even make good sense.  When am I supposed to get the strong opinions about natural birth, after I don't educate myself and have a bad experience with an over managed intervention birth as a result?  This is going to be my only child, what good would that do me then?  No, I don't get offended, I just move along and keep reading the posts.  That's how you get well rounded advice; you listen to everyone, the sweet and sour. 

    And I know that it's the maternity system we should all be mad, if you have to be mad at someone.  But the only persons with the power to change that system is the women being treated by it.  And if those women just deal with it with the attitude there's nothing they can do and it just is the way it is they aren't helping matters but perpetuating the problem.  Is that their right?  Surely so.  But it still irritates me that I'm having to deal with a crappy system in part because some refuse to question it even though they want to.  I just realize we all have to speak for ourselves now and hopefully one day we'll have a choice. 

    I know I'm a little late to the party but I agree with this. I shouldn't have to tip toe around and not speak my opinion because someone else didn't get the birth they wanted. I feel bad for people that don't get the birth they want but it is what it is. I think more women just need to own their decisions better. Even if those decisions were not what was planned and made in the heat of the moment. If you chose an epi or needed a c-section then that is what was right for you and your LO at the time. Own that decision and be proud of yourself for bringing your baby into the world the way that worked for you.

    Well that is just ridiculous.

    "Well I guess not everyone can be perfect like me, but if you're going to do everything wrong can you please just not have like, actual real feelings about it after? Cause that's just such a drag."

    That's how you sound. You, the OP, and whoever else is spouting or defending the nonsensical opinion that women who don't "research" (and lmao at how misused I'm sure that term is in this thread) their births to the correct degree of obsessiveness are lazy/unprepared/brought this upon themselves/whatever other special wording you want to throw out there.You don't have to tiptoe around everyone. Feel more than free to share your opinions. It makes it easier to spot those with a less than stellar capacity for reasoning and empathy. However, some "opinions" are more right than others, so please, know that you are wrong. Factually and otherwise.

    Obviously ditto everything Iris said, as usual. 

    Lilypie Fourth Birthday tickers Lilypie Third Birthday tickers Lilypie Pregnancy tickers
  • image cottonlily84:

    That's how you get well rounded advice; you listen to everyone, the sweet and sour. 

    And I'm sorry, I just can't help myself. No. This is not how you get "well rounded" (which I hope is your way of saying "good" or "wise") advice. You get good advice by listening to people who know what they're talking about and are capable of not only producing cogent arguments in favor of their stance, but of backing up those arguments with solid evidence (what constitutes solid evidence could of course be an entire post in itself). Just "listening" to the uninformed opinion of any idiot off the street is a great way to produce chaos and confusion. Not well rounded advice.

    Lilypie Fourth Birthday tickers Lilypie Third Birthday tickers Lilypie Pregnancy tickers
«1
Sign In or Register to comment.
Choose Another Board
Search Boards