1st Trimester

a question for my pro-choice mommies... long post

After watching Jon Stewart's interview with Mike Huckabee last night, I wondered something, and thought that I would ask a question. ?

Has your pregnancy bolstered or weakened your pro-choice position? ?

Personally, I am more strongly pro-choice than I ever have been before, and I wanted to share something that I wrote with you all. ?

What follows is a note I wrote on FB two weeks ago.?

The Private is Public is Personal is Political

So, in my current state, I have noticed that my body is now in the public domain. And, while I'm sure I invite some of it, what with my "how am I doing today" updates, it has gotten me thinking. Thinking about how as my pregnancy moves on, how my body will become less of my own, with strangers manhandling me in public, culminating in the birth, the most public, personal, private event I will probably ever have. Isn't it funny how you say the word "pregnant," and immediately discussion goes to "trying," birth control (or lack thereof), constipation, huge boobs, vomit, hemorrhoids, stretch marks, and pooping on the delivery table. And don't even talk to me about the tabloids, taking pictures of women (who either had a big lunch or just didn't make the right pants decision that morning), circling their abdomens with a caption that reads "BUMP?" When else in a human's life (when they are out of diapers) is it okay to talk this much - in public forums - regarding such personal issues?

And, maybe because of the murder of Dr. George Tiller happened while I'm pregnant, I began thinking about the issue of abortion. I have always been staunchly pro-choice (like, since I was 12), and this pregnancy has only made me more so. I still thank God every single day that I have been given the choice to have this baby, and that I have never had to make the choice otherwise. While my pregnancy hasn't been a basket of kittens, it has not been nearly as bad as some women's, and I couldn't even imagine being forced by the government to go through this insanity.?

An ongoing debate that I have been having with a former classmate, who is male, regarding this issue has really made me realize that there is nothing like any issue dealing with pregnancy to drag a woman's naked body into the public sphere and dissect it like a frog in 9th grade biology class. And what else is fascinating, is that there is no issue that puts men's bodies on the frontline of political warfare the way that women's are in issues of reproductive rights, so we cannot give them the comparison of what this private publicity is like.

We discuss issues about rape, incest, viability, selective reduction, like they're playing cards. We forget that each of the issues is a painful, personal, and private experience that women are having every day in this country, and the decision to terminate a pregnancy is the most difficult and painful one that a woman will have to make.?

I used to think, after moving my desk into a circle, discussing Roe v. Wade in countless Women's Studies seminars, that it was a mistake for Sarah Weddington to use the right to privacy as an argument for Jane Roe. But now that I'm on the other side of the issue, as a pregnant woman, and not a sassy young feminist diceminating every word of obscure feminist texts, I see why it makes sense. At this time in my life, I am feeling my most private, yet my body is going through changes that will make my private life very public, that will make strangers want to touch me, talk to me, ask me questions about my body. Sometimes I would just rather things be between me and my husband and my doctor. When an issue as personal as the decision to carry a pregnancy to term becomes a political football, it becomes okay to tear women's lifestyles, sex lives, reproductive decisions, and morality apart.?

Pregnancy makes it okay to publicly fondle us, eviscerate us on the news, kill our doctors, and make decisions about our bodies for us. Pregnancy is the private turned public, and the personal turned political.?

I had always heard that motherhood was the hardest job in the world... I just didn't know that it started so early...?

?

And to the anti-choice bumpies out there, I have already been called pro-murder, a baby killer, and compared to Hitler. ?This is my opinion, my body, and nothing you say can change that, and nothing you do will stop me from fighting. ?

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Re: a question for my pro-choice mommies... long post

  • Any post related to abortion on the bump is never a good idea.
  • image Squishycheeks:
    Any post related to abortion on the bump is never a good idea.

    My pregnancy has affected my position, and I was wondering if it was happening to anyone else. ?Aren't we supposed to be talking about how pregnancy is affecting our lives? ??

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  • epphdepphd
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    There was actually an anonymous poll on TTTC regarding this - has your IF struggle changed your views on abortion. Virtually no one said their views were changed, despite how desperately we all want children. In fact, most people's views were solidified.

    For the record, about 75% of those who took the poll listed themselves as pro-choice.

    And for my record, I was pro-choice, remained pro-choice through IF, and am still pro-choice today.  My views haven't changed a bit.

     

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  • epphdepphd
    10000 Comments Seventh Anniversary
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    image Squishycheeks:
    Any post related to abortion on the bump is never a good idea.

    Oh, so we're censoring now? Confused I think we can all be grown ups and have a productive dialogue - no need to police the conversation.

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  • I tend to be more pro-choice now.

    I know now, even after my losses, there are situations in which I would choose to terminate a pregnancy.

    I would never force someone to go through all the crap I've been through.  I can't imagine forcing someone to do this.

    I have the utmost respect for women who carry a child to term that is not going to survive outside the womb, and the utmost respect for women who give birth and go through the wrenching pain of placing a child for adoption (and thus make another couple joyful).

    I just don't think it's right to insist someone do those things, particularly when they are in a situation beyond their own choices and choosing and not through irresponsibility.


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  • ibisibis member

    I was pro-choice before and pregnancy definitely strengthened my position. I think my feeling is somewhat unusual among women who have miscarried, but even though that embryo was definitely my baby at 9 weeks, it did not change my pro-choice position. I would also still terminate if this fetus was found to have birth defects that are incompatible with life. 

    Pregnancy is utterly life-changing and comes with a number of health issues and possible dangers for the mother. I don't think anyone should have to go through it against their will, ever. I feel total conviction on that. Nor do I think there is anything wrong with a woman choosing not to carry to term a baby that will only suffer through a very short life after birth.

    I definitely think that there should be certain parameters and rules governing how and when abortions are performed. I think probably 99% of pro-choice people would agree with that.

  • image ablou:

    image Squishycheeks:
    Any post related to abortion on the bump is never a good idea.

    My pregnancy has affected my position, and I was wondering if it was happening to anyone else.  Aren't we supposed to be talking about how pregnancy is affecting our lives?   

    Just a heads up. Most women are very easily bent out of shape when it comes to this debate.

  • I would just like to point out to the Pro Lifers that Pro Choice does NOT equal Pro Abortion.

    I am Pro Choice. Even prior to my first pregnancy I was pro choice, but knew that abortion could never be an option that I would chose. However, that's my decision to make. Not the goverments.

     

  • I wonder if I am the minority here, but I am 150% pro-life. ?I am not going to drive you guys crazy with my views (I'm sure you can guess them lol), as I do not feel this is the forum for it.

    I did want to say, however, that I respect & admire ANYONE that has the courage to stand up for what he/she believes in! ?There are far too many people in this world that make decisions on topics that they are totally ignorant on and that is one of my peeves.

    ?

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  • I will also say that I went with a friend for an abortion, as her support and ride.  And it really changed my mind about my stance on abortion.  The protestors were appalling, but the clinic workers were amazing.  Non-judgmental, helpful, caring.  There were women of all situations there, and it really opened my eyes.

    As did reading the blog of a woman who works as a counselor in an abortion clinic and shares (with details skewed and obscured for privacy) what women are thinking and going through.

    I learned, really, that it's rare you know the full situation and that I cannot judge another person for this. 


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  • ibisibis member
    image aegrimm:

    I would just like to point out to the Pro Lifers that Pro Choice does NOT equal Pro Abortion.

    I am Pro Choice. Even prior to my first pregnancy I was pro choice, but knew that abortion could never be an option that I would chose. However, that's my decision to make. Not the goverments.

     

    Well, also... I would terminate in certain circumstances, but I would not exactly call myself "pro-abortion" either. I favor choice, not having abortions.

  • image epphd:

    And for my record, I was pro-choice, remained pro-choice through IF, and am still pro-choice today.  My views haven't changed a bit.

     

    me too.

    (BTW - epphd: hi (kinda) neighbor...Smile)

     


  • image ibis:
    image aegrimm:

    I would just like to point out to the Pro Lifers that Pro Choice does NOT equal Pro Abortion.

    I am Pro Choice. Even prior to my first pregnancy I was pro choice, but knew that abortion could never be an option that I would chose. However, that's my decision to make. Not the goverments.

     

    Well, also... I would terminate in certain circumstances, but I would not exactly call myself "pro-abortion" either. I favor choice, not having abortions.

    I want to make sure I wasn't misunderstood. I am saying that most women who are pro choice (in fact I can't think of one that I know of) are not actively pushing abortion. I agree with you that I would not be able to emotionally handle carrying a baby who will not be able to live out of the womb. In that case I would have to terminate a pregnancy. (My personal thoughts.)

    What I was trying ot get across was that it just seems to me that a lot of people on the "pro-life" side feel that "pro-choice" means you are OK with abortion, which I don't think is really the case. Pro-choice (to me) means that women shouldn't have to carrying a dying baby to term because the goverment says so. To me, that is detremental (sp?) to the mother's EMOTIONAL well-being.

  • I am pro life, but wasn't always.  My 1st pregnancy changed my mind.  When I went in for that 1st appointment as a young single woman and heard the heartbeat I knew that abortion wasn't just something I couldn't do...it was wrong.  I cannot imagine how anyone could silence that beating heart except to save their own life.  I carried that baby for 9 months and then handed her over in the delivery room for another woman to raise.  IMO that's the way it should be.  Once you're carrying another life inside you, you have a responsibility to protect it.
  • You asked for replies from pro-choice mommies but as a pro-life mommy to be I just wanted to say that I feel more strongly pro-life now that I'm pregnant. Seeing the heartbeat and knowing that there is a life in there, I just don't know how anyone could abort. I consider abortion a human rights issue and I support the rights of all humans, even the unborn ones.
  • No effect on me, just as someone elses choice has no effect on me =) Pro choice and always will be, even after 7 years of IF and 1 pregnancy.
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  • image aegrimm:

    I would just like to point out to the Pro Lifers that Pro Choice does NOT equal Pro Abortion.

    I am Pro Choice. Even prior to my first pregnancy I was pro choice, but knew that abortion could never be an option that I would chose. However, that's my decision to make. Not the goverments.

     

    This is exactly what I was going to say.

    "Cool as Hell like e-mail, but still timeless like a letter."
  • 150% Pro Life here in almost all cases.

    I am Pro-choice in that I believe a woman can choose to prevent getting pregnant in the first place if she is not ready to have a child, or carry it to term and offer it up for adoption etc.

    If a woman who is carrying a baby who will most certainly die after delivery,  I am a little more lenient. However, my personal belief is that instead of aborting the baby, they should deliver it, hold it as their child, love it for the few minutes they can, and say good-bye.

    Just my thoughts. After having my mc, and being pg again, I'd say I'm stronger in these opinions. 

     

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  • image aegrimm:
    image ibis:
    image aegrimm:

    I would just like to point out to the Pro Lifers that Pro Choice does NOT equal Pro Abortion.

    I am Pro Choice. Even prior to my first pregnancy I was pro choice, but knew that abortion could never be an option that I would chose. However, that's my decision to make. Not the goverments.

     

    Well, also... I would terminate in certain circumstances, but I would not exactly call myself "pro-abortion" either. I favor choice, not having abortions.

    I want to make sure I wasn't misunderstood. I am saying that most women who are pro choice (in fact I can't think of one that I know of) are not actively pushing abortion. I agree with you that I would not be able to emotionally handle carrying a baby who will not be able to live out of the womb. In that case I would have to terminate a pregnancy. (My personal thoughts.)

    What I was trying ot get across was that it just seems to me that a lot of people on the "pro-life" side feel that "pro-choice" means you are OK with abortion, which I don't think is really the case. Pro-choice (to me) means that women shouldn't have to carrying a dying baby to term because the goverment says so. To me, that is detremental (sp?) to the mother's EMOTIONAL well-being.

    I consider myself pretty hardcore pro-life

    That being said, i think that MEDICAL abortions should be allowed. If the baby will not be able to survive, or it will kill the mother, then terminating the pregnancy is sometimes the right course of action

    However, ELECTIVE abortions i am VERY much against. Some women use abortions as a form of birth control. a friend of mine had so many in earlier years that her uterus is now unable to support the baby she desires at this point in her life. I think the terminology "pro-choice" usually means "having teh choice to kill a healthy, viable baby for no medical reason" I am never going to agree with that no matter what you say

    I think that elective abortions should be illegal, and medical terminations should be allowed. Plus, I know that if i ever had to terminate due to incapatability with life, it would not be the "choice" I would like to make, it would be medically necessary in my eyes.

  • I was vehemently pro-life before having children. I am now pro-choice.

    Sorry..had to edit.

  • epphdepphd
    10000 Comments Seventh Anniversary
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    image SoonerBred:
      Some women use abortions as a form of birth control. 

    Most do not.  Most women who abort are not repeat customers.  Most are married.  Most already have kids.  Most are poor and don't have access to effective birth control or the understanding of how to use it.  I think it's a big misconception to assume that everyone who walks into planned parenthood (for instance) is irresponsible and cavalier.  Yes, some are - but most are not.

     

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  • image epphd:

    image SoonerBred:
      Some women use abortions as a form of birth control. 

      Yes, some are - but most are not.

     

    Hence my use of the word "some" :) i know most do not do that, but that it does happen. And i don't think people should have the option of doing that

  • Here...to "settle" the debate. Statistics show that approximately 47% of abortions are performed on women who have already had a previous abortion.

    Here's a link with some more stats (and before anyone jumps my ass, stats are NOT 100% reliable...just estimates)

    http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html
  • mooetamooeta member
    image Squishycheeks:
    image ablou:

    image Squishycheeks:
    Any post related to abortion on the bump is never a good idea.

    My pregnancy has affected my position, and I was wondering if it was happening to anyone else.  Aren't we supposed to be talking about how pregnancy is affecting our lives?   

    Just a heads up. Most women are very easily bent out of shape when it comes to this debate.

    I don't think any pro-choicer is pro-abortion.  I think all of us would rather it be unnecessary outside of medical necessity.  Pro-choice is not pro-abortion, just a woman's right to choose.  We respect your right to choose to keep your child.  Respect our right to think that women should have a CHOICE in the matter.

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  • No, it has not changed my stance on abortion at all.  My body is still my body. Other women's bodies are still their bodies. Just because I am pregnant doesn't mean I all of a sudden should be telling other women what to do.
  • My stance has not changed. To me, the right to have an abortion is the right for a woman to have privacy over her own body - it's a women's rights issue and that gets lost in this debate. A man's privacy will never be the topic of a hot debate...they're too busy creating the next Viagra.

    Denying a women's right to chose is a huge step back in the continuing fight for women's rights.

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  • I'm pro-choice. It doesn't mean I'm "pro-abortion," though I am not against it either. Being pregnant hasn't changed my stance at all.

     I am a school counselor, and I work with high school aged students. Seeing a young 14/15/16/17/18 year old girl pregnant when she is scared, unprepared, and just a child herself is heartbreaking. Watching others as they condemn her for being a "whore" or a "slut" is just sad...especially when, let's face it, the majority of teen girls are having sex. Some are "less fortunate" than others and end up pregnant. Should they have to even go through the agonizing months of rejection, ridicule, and fear because the government (and right-wing politicos) equate abortion with murder? I think not. That young lady should have the right to choose whatever option is best for her. We all need to step back and be less judgmental. Besides, if abortion is murder, then so is capital punishment.

  • I was pro-life before ever becoming pregnant, and became even more pro-life after seeing DS on u/s at 6 weeks, then born 33 weeks later. ?He was a baby at 6 weeks and he was a baby at 39 weeks. ?I don't believe in ending innocent life.
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  • image aegrimm:

    However, that's my decision to make. Not the goverments.

     

    This. I don't want anyone else's religious preferences to inhibit my ability to seek medical care, and I don't want my preferences to inhibit anyone else's.

    There's legitimate reasons someone might need/want an abortion,  and legitimate reasons why someone might need a blood transfusion. Let the government regulate for our safety and health, otherwise? Pro-Choice. Because it's my body. (But no, I would never get an abortion.)

  • I was pro-life before and I'm even more pro-life now.  Seeing a living being inside of me with a heart and brain and even arm and leg buds reinforced my position. 

    I believe that the right to life is greater than the right to privacy.  I also challenge you to find the words "right to privacy" in the U.S. Constitution.  It's not there.  You will find the words "right to life" however. 

    I am pro choice in that I believe a woman has a right to choose to not get pregnant or to choose to give up a child for adoption. 

     

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